NEPAL: One more Indian priest quits Pashupatinath
Posted by barunroy on January 5, 2009
By Sudeshna Sarkar
Kathmandu, Jan 4: As the controversy over the ouster of three Indian priests from Nepal’s Pashupatinath temple, one of the holiest shrines of billions of Hindus worldwide, deepened Monday, a fourth Indian priest handed over his resignation while temple authorities engaged two more Nepali priests in violation of a court order.
Ganesh Bhatt, one of the two remaining Indian priests at the 17t century temple, quit reportedly fearing for his safety.
Narottam Vaidya, a former official of the trust that administers the shrine, told IANS that Bhatt had been receiving threats and feared for his life.
Vaidya, who is among the three groups of people who have moved Nepal’s Supreme Court asking it to strike down the “illegal” new appointments of two Nepali priests, also predicted that the remaining Indian priest would also quit.
“At present the fifth Indian priest is on leave,” Vaidya said. “He has gone home in south India for 35 days.”
Gopal Kiranti, the Maoist minister for culture and state restructuring, confirmed that Bhatt had left but rejected the allegation that the Young Communist League (YCL), the strong arm of the Maoists, had intimidated the Indians into leaving.
“It’s a question of giving a dog a bad name and hanging it,” he said. “People are laying every crime at the door of the YCL.”
The Maoist leader said that the resignation of the Indians had been accepted and there was no question of reinstating them.
As if in confirmation, the Pashupatinath Area Development Trust that manages the shrine Sunday announced it had appointed two more junior Nepali priests to assist the newly appointed two Nepali senior priests.
The appointments come on the very day the trust as well as the Prime Minister’s Office and Kiranti received a stay order from Nepal’s Supreme Court, asking them not to appoint new priests and to allow the old ones to continue till the dispute was resolved.
Kiranti said his office would reply to the Supreme Court, defending the appointments of Nepalis in the place of the Indians, a move that broke away from a nearly 300-year-old tradition.
“We need a new Pashupati in a new Nepal,” he said.
Asked if the Maoist government, which sees religion as the opium of masses, would now also try to intervene in the running of two other hallowed shrines in Nepal – the Swayambhunath and Bouddhanath temples worshipped by Buddhists and Jains, Kiranti said that the will of the Nepali people would be obeyed.
JTM said
“We need a new Pashupati in a new Nepal,” he said.
————————————————————
So they want to change Shiva (Pashupatinath )also in Nepal?
What will they call this new Shiva? Maopatinath?
In any case I thought new nepal meant a new country moving towards people upliftment, economic progress, etc
I never knew they meant changing gods and godesses.
Nisha Tamang said
A New Pashupatinath in Nepal means placing Nepalese priests..in a way I would agree in this replacement, for the abolishment of Mocarchy in Nepal should be full and final and why not brush off the remains of it too…??
I just hope New Nepal of today wont be a sarcasm for the whole world..Prachanda! I wish you weren’t a parasite..!! you have made a fool of your people..
JTM said
But if those Sn guys have ben around for yaers, are’nt they not Nepalese too? but of Sn Indian origin, just like these Dahals and Dhakals are also of some Indian region origin. Thier faces definitely do not look like some Mt tribe bred lot. Ekdam banaras ko panda lagchan
Nisha Tamang said
tyo ta bilkulai thik bhannu bhayo Jyoti di, yeah! they are Nepalese citizen atleast for me since they have lived in this place for such a long time..but I was talking interms of monarchism..since so much of weird things have happened in Nepal, I would not in the least mind the priests being removed from Pashupatinath who were in a way shadows of the former king..the SHAH DYNASTY!
Definitely, Prachanda is also an Indian origin..how I wish I could punch his long nose and make it flat! Saala le badnaam garisakyo Nepal ko janatalai..
JTM said
I cannot understand when the USA is all set to welcome their first ‘Colored’ President, why Nepal is going all ‘Nepalese’including even making a Nepalese version of a temple to a god who is actually considered to be Shiva the Supreme Yogi?
And who and what is Nepalese can someone please explain to me?
JTM said
I ahd once mentioned that there is striking resemblance between Pakistani President Asaf Zardari and Pushpa Kamal Dahal. Must be from the same stockyard.
JTM said
Then Pracahnd has reported to call the episode just a ‘coincidence’.
Yaeh as coincincidental as his ‘Jurwa’ bhai lost from each other in some mela.
soulpower said
MORE LIKE FROM THE SAME
JUNGLE
PIGSTY
SLUM
POLITICAL TERROR CAMP
ISI BATCH
RAMPANT WOMANISING FATHER
………….ETCC……..ETC(JUST USE UR IMAGINATION!)
Patleybaskounpad said
One of the poorest countries in the world first messes around with the calender and then begins tweaking religion, i don’t see much hope for the erstwhile hindu kingdom if the energies of the state are spent on such non issues.
Riyazuddin said
Maoists are doing what they are expected to do, this is an indicator of things to come. Dont be surprised if Prachanda repeats Tiananmen Square.
layman said
I see everyone has something to say.
OPINION is like a NOSE everyone has one.
JTM said
Now that Pracahnd has agreed to the orders of the Supreme Court of nepal, the subject should now be closed.
dilip said
It is good to hear such pleasnt news. Now we have got rid of one kind of pollute, no doubt we can clean up rest of Nepal.
Kirati priest should preside over Pashupatinath.
This is all respect to Lord Siva Mahadev who is a Lord of Kiratas and is known as Kirateswor.
Jai Siva Mahadev Kirateswor
RAJA said
oi kirate babu
bagwan is not your own property so that you have to keep GOD in your dirty pocket …. who is worshipping that doesn’t matter you fool ….
dilip said
Siva, generally conceived as a non-Aryan deity, secured a prominent place in Kirata pantheon. It can be roughly asserted that Siva worship must have begum among the Kiratas in the mountainous regions of the Himalayas in pre-Vedic times before the advent of Aryans. That is why, Siva(Kiratesvara=the God of the Kiratas) has been considered as pre-Aryan God. On the basis of an episode as described in the Mahabharata, as well as, the Kiratarjuniyam of Bharavi the Kirata can be identified with Siva.” pg. 238, Kiratas in Ancient India by G.P Singh, 1990.
The word Shiva has root in the Kirata or Borok race, not in the Vedas because Shiva as god is not mentioned in it. Shiva is hybrid of two Kirata words, simani means Gyan or knowledge and Kaiba, means five, i.e. Si+Ba=Siba>Siva>Sibarai>Sibrai . That means a god who has knowledge of five elements of life, that is earth, fire, water, air, and sky, that is cosmic rays which forms the life. That is one who has created life in this world or creator of life in the world. Other meaning can be one who made us perceive or feel five senses in our body, that is who is the soul of the boy. It is this Sibrai converted to Shivai in Sanskrit. From this five shiva is said to have five face and named as “Panchanan.”
In support, this link http://www.tripura.org.in/origin.htm describes the early civilization of the Kiratas
dilip said
Raja;
My bottomline is if Siva is recognized as tribal(Kiratas)God, from the ancient text such as Veda with support from scholars,
why should Indians be the priest at the Lord Pashupatinath.
Therefore regarding Indian priest being booted out of Lord Pashupatinath temple, it is a great achievement by the present Nepali government.
It’s a matter of fact that these Indian priest has NOT only polluted the Nepal most sacred temple But also took all the money and gifts to the temple offered by
millions of devotees for themselves and into India.
Now hopefully the new government can put Kirati priest which is the rightful servant of Lord Siva Mahadev Kirateswor.
Kirati priest should preside over Pashupatinath.
This is all respect to Lord Siva Mahadev and to integrity of Nepal and its people.
Jai Siva Mahadev Kirateswor
Siva as Kirati God from the Mahabaharata eic.
The scripts says, the legend of Siva Mahadeva, the Great God, taking the guise of a Kirata,
with Uma with him as a Kirata woman, to test Arjuna when he was practicing religious penance in the Himalayas: a legend which may have
its germs in the following vers of the Sata-rudriya section of the White Yajurveda (XVI, 7):
Asau yo vasarpati nila-grivo vilohitah
utainam gopa adrsrann vdaharyah: sa drsto mrdayati nah
May he who glides away, whose neck is azure, and whose hue is red, he whom the herdsmen, whom the girls who carry water have
beheld, may he when seen be kind to us.” (Trans. by Ralph T. Griffith, Benares, 1899.)
Therefore regarding to Indian priest being booted out of Lord Pashupatinath temple, this highlights the great work done by the present government.
It’s a matter of fact that these Indian priest has NOT only polluted the Nepal most sacred temple But also took all the money and gifts to the temple offered by
millions of devotees for themselves and into India. Now hopefully the new government can put Kirati priest which is the rightful servant of Lord Siva Mahadev Kirateswor.
Kirati priest should preside over Pashupatinath.
This is all respect to Lord Siva Mahadev and to intregrity of Nepal and its people.
Jai Siva Mahadev Kirateswor
JTM said
What is this nonsense abt Shiva being a kirati god and there should be no Indian priests.
It is like saying Jesus Christ should only be worshipped by Aramaic or by Jewish priests.
It is like saying Buddha only belongs to nepal.
If the integration of Nepal depends on the ownership of gods then it is a social failure.
I cannot believe that mindsets such as the above blogger exists anywhere leave alone Nepal.
dilip said
JTM it’s not me who is saying all this. Whatever i have said, came from Mahabharat script, scholars text and the study of Kiratas history and culture. Kiratas civilization is older than the veda or the indus civilization.
In ancient Indian text such as Mahabharata and Ramayana, the adivasi(indigenous) were called Kiratis.
From Ramayana:
In Yoga Vasistha 1.15.5 Rama speaks of kirAteneva vAgurA, a trap [laid] by Kiratas, so about BCE Xth Century, they were thought of as jungle trappers, the ones who dug pits to capture roving deer.
The Kiratas in Vedic Literature.
———————————
The name Kirata is for the first time found in the Yajurveda (Sukla Yajurveda, Vajasaneya, XXX, 16;
also Krsna Yajurveda, Taittiriya Brahmana, III, 4,12,1).
“The Kirat (Sanskrit: किरात) mentioned in early Hindu texts are the tribals or Adivasi of the land.
Therefore the janajatis who are the adivasi of Nepal are the KIRATAS.
Now who wants to challenge the ancient work of Vedas should challenge his own existence!
In addition he should challenge all the scholars who have penned down this findings.
work reference:
KIRATA-JANA-KRTI by Suniti Kumar Chatterji
The Kiratas in Ancient India by G.P Singh
A study of three Kirata communities in the Eastern Himalayas by T.B. Subba
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirant_Mundhum
In support, this link http://www.tripura.org.in/origin.htm describes the early civilization of the Kiratas and Siva as Kirata Lord.
JTM said
Dear Dilip
Okay Shiva maybe was discovered by the Aryan Hindus after the Kiratis. But the worship of any God should not be judged by whether the priest is Indian or Nepalese just like the followers of the faith are universal.
The introduction of Buddhism in Tibet is attributed to three….Buddhist Princess Bhrikuti of Nepal and another Chinese Buddhist princess married to a Tibetan prince. The third being Guru Padmasambhava who was also not Tibetan. But today the world knows Buddhism largely through Tibetan Buddhism. The Lama Budhism was not also started by Gautam Buddha but by Guru Padmasambhava.
So……………………
BTW How many ‘Kiratis’ are Shaivites today, pl tell me?
dilip said
Dear JTM
and the rest of my fellow Nepali brothers and sisters,
actually this was a shocking revelation that our most revered deity has been under the guardianship of a foreigner for a long time! An outsider accumulates all the wealth offered in cash and valuable kind and sends it off to his country. This must be unacceptable to everybody – religious or atheist, Hindu or non-Hindu”
I have never thought or imagined for the past hundred of years that outsider(Indian) was the priest at our most sacred temple.
And what’s the consequence of this may i ask?
Well you can see the conditions of our sacred temples and its surroundings. Now who is in charge of collecting all the funds donated to the temples? How much of the funds is allocated in maintenance’s of the temple and its surroundings?
Secondly we need to know that caste system only came about through the formation of Hinduism. Hinduism was brought by Aryan.
In reference to Hinduism, it is wiser to say that Hinduism is a derivation of tribal God/Goddess/practices/rituals.
That’s why Hinduism have so many God and Goddess which you already have confessed that Siva is Kirata Lord. In support many Kirata
Siva murti/caves exist throughout India testifying Siva as Lord of Kiratas.
Secondly there is no definite founder of Hinduism, except scholars and historians have beginning to understand that Hinduism is a “Borrowed” or “plagiarize”
religion which why i said that it is a derivation of tribal religions, for after the advent and expansion of Aryans civilization, the Aryans took all the tribal religions
and God and make it as their own with some modification. That’s how caste system came to exist.
While not disrespecting the Hindu religion, i feel that it is better to know the TRUTH instead of being lied even if it comes down to controversial and being remarked as racist.
So the so called Sudras and the untouchable were never allowed to enter Lord Pashupatinath when Indian priest were presiding the temple.
Just imagine, why there are Magar(Kirati) priest at Manakamana Temple, Budha Subbha and Dakshin kali which is so called Hindu temple?
Sometimes we need to do soul searching. Hope JTM and many of you who after reading this articles will do some soul searching.
It is better to know than to be ignorant.
While
“An ignorant person is one who doesn’t know what you have just found out.”
Finally JTM, i’m not saying that Kirati priest should preside the Lord Pashupatinath temple. Any Nepali regardless of their caste should do it.
Like you said the followers of the faith are universal. I just want to suggest and highlight the truth that’s all.
I’m sure that many Nepalis do not even know that Siva is Lord of Kirata hence Siva other name is Kirateswor.
In additional i feel that since Kirateswor is Lord of Kiratas, It is more practical and more symbolism to have Kirati priest as the servant of the Lord.This is all respect to Lord Siva Mahadev and to intregrity of Nepal and its people. But again any Nepali priest is fine but never a foreigner again.
JTM, still today Kiratis pray to Siva as their Lord.
Kirat religion is not Hindusm. It is Kirati Mundhum. This practice is also known as Kirat Veda, Kirat-Ko Veda or Kirat Koved.
Kirats shamanism and their rituals are mostly related to the worship of mother nature and ancestors. Almost all sacred rituals are performed by nakchong, the kirat priest.
Their supreme deity Tagera Nyingmaphuma is personified as Lord Siva.
For additional support, you can link to this site: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirant_Mundhum
Therefore we should be glad that Indian pujaris are booted out of our sacred temples. This is one good thing done by our present government.
Jai Siva Mahadev Kirateswor, Jai Nepal
JTM said
Well you can see the conditions of our sacred temples and its surroundings. Now who is in charge of collecting all the funds donated to the temples? How much of the funds is allocated in maintenance’s of the temple and its surroundings?
——————————————————-
Dear Dilip first you shgould get authentic answers to these questions and also about the funds going outside. Then a discussion should be held. Pl kindly do not get so agitated on just hauva talk. I find a lot of matters are bothering people today, which is not bad, but kindly get the facts and then act or react. Why waste energy on imaginary things? You might be right but kindly find ways of access to the actual accounts and details. The Maovadi govt for the rights of the people should be able to provide easy access to accountability.
As for yr foreigner problem, I wouild like to enlighten you that there are 1000s of Nepalese practicing priests in India. So kindly remove this ‘foreigner’ bee fom yr bonnet. Thank you
JTM said
There is a temple/ ashram established by a Gorkha in India who donated his entire life’s earnings as soldier for this temple/site. As per the parampara, the temple always had nepali-origin mahants and was known as the Gorkha mandir. Now the temple’s Gorkha heruatge is being erased even to the extent of erasing the founder who was a Gorkha. Even his descendants who want to pay obeisance are chased away from the temple so that nobody comes to know that a Gorkha had built it. There are two old Nepali mahants there counting there last days. A new mahant of non-Nepali origin has been installed to take over from the traditional Nepali mahants once they are no more. A temple trust has been formed who refuse to acknowledge that it is Gorkhali temple, that it was built by a Gorkhali to honour the ancient diety whose blessings Gorkha warriors sought in the 18th-19th century.
now tell me according to your philosophy, what is happening in this temple is correct?
dilip said
Well JTM the question i raised was to wake the people up.
I know myself that i do not have answers to these question but as you can see the conditions at the Lord Pasupathinath temple.
Every day there are thousands of devotees coming in and lot of cash and other valuables are offered to the temple.
So you tell me why the condition of the temple is so dilated and its surroundings well i don’t have to describe.
Well as far as i am concerned the cash and all other valuables that are offered to Lord Kirateswor can easily be seen that it is pick up by Brahmins from India.
Even there are many other people hoping that the Kirati priest should officiate at Lord Pasupathinath temple.
Just read the exctract below:
“I am very happy to hear that the recent
appointment of two non-Kirati priests at
Pashupatinath has been revoked (“PM
revokes Pashupati appointments”, Jan. 8,
Page 1). The new appointments should be
made with the objective of recapturing the
past of Kirateswor Pashupatinath. All the
senior priests of the temple should be
appointed from the Kirat community and
the junior priests should be represented by
dalits. Such appointments would bring back
the glory of the caste less Nepal before the
import of caste system from India by Jaya
Sthiti Malla in the thirteenth century.”
VP Sayami
Kathmandu
http://74.125.93.104/search?q=cache:WBz4kfgDmF8J:blogmandu.files.wordpress.com
/2009/01/kathmandu_post_page5pashupati_row_jan10.pdf+kirat+priest+Pashupatinath&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
Sayami said that by picking priest from Kirat community and dalit as junor priest, it recapture two essence here.
1. reviving the past of Kirateswor Pashupatinath.
2. the glory of the caste less Nepal again.
Now you tell me this philosophy? Do you want a caste less system and live in a truth or do you still want to remain in the glory of Bahunism philosophical life:
Well let me describe what is the Bahunism philosophical life:
The Proponents of Bahunism:
—————————–
“Let me quote you from the Reg-Vedas, the holiest script of the Hindus. These quotes clearly project their racial egoism at the cost of other castes and despising that has continued even from that ancient epic age. ” The Bahun was born from the mouth, the Chetri from the arms, the Vaishya from the thighs and the Sudhra from the foot”. Can any one imagine a man born from the mouth “Worship Bahun even he has no merits. But never worship a Sudra, whatever qualities, merits and skills he might have. The penance you observe for killing a sudra is equal to the penance for killing a cat, a kitten or a grasshopper. The trader, the Kirat(mongol), the Kayastha, the gardener, the weaver, the Chandal (untouchable), the Kol ect: are born from the Bottom of the Bahun. To talk with them is a crime, which can be erased only by looking at the sun. Never share wisdom with the Sudra. The Sudras should never earn wealth, or else they will afflict the Bahuns. For the Sudras, left over food for eating, torn cloths for wearing, and hay for sleeping, will be fitting.” These are some of the quotes from their holy scripts. Even in the Geeta they have demonstrated their communal attitude: “The prostitutes, the Sundrs and the women are of sinful births.” The non-Hindu Mongol people, who have accepted the lowest Sudra status of the caste-order, learn a lesson from these quotes (56-57).”
This is excerpts from the Nepali Rajniti ma Adhekhai Sachai (Hidden facts in Nepalese Politics) by Gopal Gurung
Dear JTM,
Gorkha dynasty is history and so are their parampara which has still no connexion with the tribal Gods.
But the TRUTH of Parampara is that Siva is Lord Kirateswor(Lord of Kiratas)
As for your 1000s of Nepalese practicing priests in India, i don’t mind having some of them presiding in Nepali temple.
The God remains the same. Except the rituals and customs has come under foreign influence and i definitely do not want to see indian priest in Nepali temple.
JTM said
Mr Dilip
The last time Pashupatinath was in the news it was because the Indian priests were to be replaced by Nepalese Brahmin priests. What is the difference? Are’nt all the Bhatts, Dahals, etc Nepalised versions of Indian origin Brahmins who came there long ago to practise the religion.
AS for Gorkha, pl do also bear in mind that the place was named after Baba Gorakhnath, the 11th century saint, a Shaivite and proponent of Hath Yoga…all connects to Shiva …the greatest Yogi….. The Gorkha communities in Nn India where I comje from, always have a Gorakhnath temple and worship him even in their homes. So where Gorkha as per him and our identity as Gorkhas is not history for us. For Nepal it is history as it has declared itself to be. But I dont think Gorkha should be totally connected with every Shah. Gorkha was already named Gorkha bfeore the first Shah king became Raja there Ithink somehwre in the 16th century, 4 centuries after baba Gorakhnath meditated there. Gorkhas and Shahs canbe considered as separate entities today. Dont sacrifice the Gorkha legacy because of the Shahs. The gorkha army army of P Shah consisted mainly of Magars and Gurungs who were the locals of Gorkha before the Shahs turned up from Chittore or wherever as they claim.
dilip said
Dear Jtm, this is regarding Lord Buddha.
you said
“But today the world knows Buddhism largely through Tibetan Buddhism. The Lama Budhism was not also started by Gautam Buddha but by Guru Padmasambhava.”
But don’t forget that Buddhism strive and existed today because of Kiratas. Kiratas did not teach any caste. In addition the Kiratas has always been tolerant of other teachings though Kiratas religions is Kirati Mundhum, which is worship of mother nature and ancestors. Therefore Buddhism flourished under the Kiratas.
Here’s some extract:
” The Kiratis were a tribal hill people who came from the East. (The Ramayana mentions them as being dwellers of the north-eastern Himalayan region.) The Kirati invasion of the Kathmandu Valley occurred sometime around 700 BC. The most famous among the Kirati rulers was Yalambar – the first of them.
Jitadassi, the seventh king, is said to have helped the Pandavas during the great war of the Hindu epic the Mahabharata. It was also during the reign of Jitadassi that Gautama Buddha was said to have visited the Valley. The Kiratis’ rule saw a succession of 29 kings until Gasti, the last of them, was defeated by the Licchavis at around AD 200.
http://www.baronboutique.com/about_nepal.htm
It is even mentioned that Lord Buddha is Kiratra avatar as stated in this website:http://tripatlas.com/Kirata
The most famous Kiratas in Hinduism are the Kiratra avatar of Shiva, Lord Buddha and sage Valmiki, writer of the Ramayana.
And by reading your comments, you still want to have Indians Brahmins in the temple don’t you?
Finally don’t forget that Gurung and Magar are also Kirat.
If you study the meaning of Kirata from the Veda and other ancient indian scripts closely, Gurung and Magar too are Kirat by definition.
Therefore it’s no doubt that Magar(kirat) have been pujari(priest)
even before the conquest of Gorkha dynasty by PNS.
Secondly the origin Hindu deity are deity of Kirata. Even some hindu festivals to Kirata. Believe it or not but you need to do some soul searching.
Many scholars have started to find out the root of the Hinduism only recently and many books have been published.
It’s just that Hinduism became a world religion through Indian(aryan)Brahmins. There weren’t many study done on tribals(adivasi) before.
There’s internet, enough texts out there and most importantly we are more educated than our ancestors. If you start looking for the roots of Hinduism, and the ancient tribes of India, you will find out the TRUTH!
Origin religion of hinduism is religion of adivasi/tribal.
barunroy said
Dear Dilip,
Greetings from Darjeeling! Your source Baron Boutique is an online store and it suggests that “Jitadassi, the seventh King of the Kirats to have fought in the Mahabharata War.” In the very next sentence the writer writes, it was it was during his Gautama Buddha visited the Valley” I am not a historian but were the Pandavas contemporary to Gautama Buddha a vice versa.
Please choose your sources, very carefully.
Regs
barun
JTM said
The Gorkha legacy should have actually been reinforced from Nepal. We in India are doing our best. First the Gorkha heritage without the Shahs have to be saved, then we will worry abt Kiratis and who discovered Lord Shiva first. Actually the holy trio Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesh represent the creation of the whole brahmand the universe including ‘living’ creatures like you and me and the bacteria inside us.
Yes I do agree that Brahmins cannot hold the sacred role anymore (they themselves do not want to practise the role but want to enjoy the social psn anyway). Nahi Chalega. All wannabe priests have to acquire the Acharya degree from a recognised institution. Admissions should be open to all with no reservations for caste, creed,gender or religion.
I get yr point that Shiva worship and the other ‘factors’ Hinduism were not brought to the Kiratis by the ‘Aryan Hindus’ from below Nepal. The philosophies already existed in the knowledge of the mt people. In fact many aspects of Hinduism seems to have been learnt and incorporated from the ‘Kirati’ culture. Something like Christianity…from the time of Christ…and the Romanisation and the anglicisation of the religion. Exorcism, holy water (like our ganga jal) and other rites in Christanity also have been incorporated from ancient practices.
Many theories already existed. The Aryans gave them forms and names. All ancient cultures worshipped nature… the sun, moon, wind etc…its not that only Hindus have a Surya devata. But many modern religions dismissed the worship of nature as paganism and ignorance.
RAJA said
Mostly Dilip was an unemplyed priest of nepal few year back but new mao govt. has recruited him as a pujari of pasupathinath temple ….By the way some day he might have claimed that Lord Shiva was his family property (now according to him Lord Shiva is property Kiratis),even hi might have said his great grand father was most favourite bhakts of Lord shiv and used to take secret prasad (ganjas) with Nandi, Viringi (sevak of Lord Shiva)& even with Lord shiva in heaven….so funny
barunroy said
I think the quoted links here including http://www.tripura.org.in doesn’t seem to be authentic historical analysis. I have very much doubt about what is written on these sites.
JTM said
Anyway I guess ancient practices went a little too wild…human sacrifices…superstitions…etc. Good night for today.
dilip said
Dear Raja,
i know you must be either confuse or dread about the TRUTH being expose slowly. I don’t blame you. It’s the system you see about how we were all brought up, believing that Hinduism was created by Aryan God through the medium of Brahmin’s while discrediting and disrespecting the OWNER(indigenous tribes) of ancient India with the propaganda and lies of Brahmins.
But many Indian as well as foreign scholars after studying deeply
have started to doubt that and even prove to some points that it is otherwise as mentioned in many texts.
Hello barunroy, the link http://www.tripura.org.in/origin.htm
do have authentic historical value.
What do you doubt about The Origin of Tripuri People?
Anyway folks,
i got this information and would like to share with you.
It’s not only me who is saying Siva is Lord of Kirata.
Here’s a complete article that raises some serious issues.
I am going to elaborate more when i have done more reading from here and other sources. Happy readings my dear fellow beings!
“Hindu Religion Is Religion OF Kirant” http://sunuwaruk.org/chandra4.htm
By Chandra Prakash Sunuwar
Dhobighat, Lalitpur, Kathmandu
Email: cpsunuwar@hotmail.com
The Hindu religion:
There are different opinions regarding of the birth of Hindu religion. There is literally a tug of war between the scholars’ one in favor of Dravidian origin and other of Aryan origin. There is hardly any third opinion on that though a small section feels that it has originated from indigenous tribal of India. This is because no great man of this origin had ever tried to write or researched to claim that Hindu religion is born from their indigenous tribal faith. According to The greatest historian of Tripura state whose name is DR DEV BURMAN.
In his research One group of kiranti who ruled and live in Tripura state still succeed to protect their kirant language intact from ancient kiranti language which is language of Borok race who live in Tripura state of India because this kiranti people were none stop ruled since 5000 years in northern India till British East India company which is later involved in British colony. Earlier the name of Tripura was Kiratbhumi, it’s capital was in Tribeg. It means land of Kirat, the Tripuris used to be called previously. the word ‘Tripura’ originated from the king Tripur who happens to rule the state. According to the legend Tripur was the 39th descendent of Druhya, who was descendent of Yayati kirant, one of the lunar race kings. He was so mighty that he ordered his subjects not to worship any god other than him, had no faith in god. He started torturing the subjects who defies his order. People fled in a body escape from his tyranny to near by state of Hiramba (Cachar).
The history of Tripura is very old. It dates back to the era of the Mahabharata. The name of the Tripura was mentioned in the the above epic along with the states like Manipur, Kamrup (Assam) etc. no doubt it was none other than present Tripura, though its location has changed from its past. Tripura’s name is also mentioned in the list of states that was mentioned in the Ashoka’s pillar that is now reserved in Saranath. Hiuen Tsang also mentioned in his travelogue about the presence of great Boro/Borok kirant kingdom in the east of Bengal. The ‘Tripura’ is a small kingdom, unattached with British of India. It was an independent country till the merger with union of India in 1949 A.D. There are different opinion and explanation about the origin of word Tripura among scholars and historian.
Other kiranti people of nepal like SUNUWAR,RAI,LIMBU AND YAKKHA Their language is almost changed from ancient kirant language because of migration and geography and dynamic of Time before all kirata has same language.
First of all the word Hindu itself has root to non-aryan. Kirata or Borok origin with Sindu or Chindi river through the Indus civilisation, is not at all the Indo-Aryan one. Secondly the theory of Hindu religions birth from indo-Aryan faith is null and void by the following facts. Let us look at the list of names of Gods which the Indo-Aryan people had brought when they invaded Indus civilisation. Rig-veda has all the names of god which the Indo-Aryan used to worship when they first came to India.
Their faith and philosophy were based on these gods only. The rituals, procedure and hymn etc were detailed in the sacred text of Vedas. Some of the primary and powerful gods mentioned in the Rig-Vedas are Indra, Agni, Varun, Vrihaspati, Brahma, Arundhati, Soma, Vayu, Aswin, Rhitu, Marut, Rudra, Ribhus, Savitar, Brahmanspati. But in the present day Hindu religion none of the Vedic god is worshipped in India. The Brahma is the only one ha temple at Puskar in Rajasthan, and he too does not have any day fixed through out a year. ARAD who was post man of Aryan. He doesn’t have any temple and not worshiped. There is no god of Aryan or Vedic origin in the list of Hindu Gods of modern India, other than doubtfully the Vishnu which is considered to be origin of Dravidian.
In Dravidian language Bisnu Means god of BLUE SKY,CLOUD AND VAST SEA. On the contrary none of the Hindu gods of modern India is mentioned or had a place in Vedas. These facts clearly prove that the Hindu religion and its gods are neither born from Aryan faith nor derived from Vedic gods and philosophy.
The major Ancient Civilizations:
There were four major civilizations in the world, all of which were founded in Asia. These were: Chinese, Egyptian, and Mesopotamia and Indus civilization. All the civilizations were interrupted by unknown circumstance other than Chinese civilization which is continuing till date.
Indus civilization:
The civilization of Chinese, Egyptian and Mesopotamia were of homogeneous group of people, where as the Indus civilization was found to be comprised of heterogeneous group of human race. The skulls found of Harappa and Mohenjo-Daro belonged to proto-australoid, Mongoloid, Mediterranean and Alpine races. This clearly proved that the mongoloid were also part of the Indus civlisation. The proto-australoid were ancestor of modern day’s Santal, Kol, Bhil, Munda etc. tribes of central India, Mediterranean were ancestor of modern day’s Tamil, Telegu, etc. but no skull was found of from the site of excavation belonging to Aryan people.
Who are the descendants of mongoloid living during Indus civilization in present day in India? These are none other than the present day’s indo-mongoloid people or the Kirata or the Borok race living in India namely, Himalyan mongoloid tribes, Kinnours, Spitian, Lahuli, Koch, Mech, Bodo, Rabha, Garo, Tiwas, Dimasa, Kachhari, Karabi, Tripuri etc.
Other Proof of Kirata living in the Indus valley
By the name of rivers in Indus valley:
There were many rivers that passed through the Indus civilization. According to famous ethnologist Cunningham any river whose name ends with ti or di indicates that it was once inhabited by Sino-Tibetan race. Most of the river name of Indus valley were in Borok/Kirata origin, for examples the ‘Ravi river’ was earlier Rawa-ti, ‘Bias river’ was Nyang-ti, ‘satlez’ was-Zong-ti, ‘Para river’ was Para-ti, Saraswati was Solsolti, Gomati was Gomati, Jammu tawi was Jomuti/Somti, Tapti etc. It clearly proofs that once in the ancient time these valleys were inhabited by Sino-Tibetan or Borok race. On the contrary there is no river whose name begins or ends with ti or di in the southern part of India, beyond the Bindhya parbat, which had never been inhabited by the Borok race.
Name of rivers and Places in the Sub-Himalayan region:
There are numerous examples that proves that Borok race once lived in the Himalyan region. Places name: Dehradoon>Di-ran-doong, Teheri>Tiyari, Kampti fall >Kapti > Kaptwi, Khumbu valley>Khumuk valley, Tripura Sundari Temple in Kulu etc.
Rivers Name: Bhagirathi>Bagroti, Gangutri>Gungti, Yamunatri>Yungti, Tista>Twisuta, Tursa>Twiursa, Riang twima, Terai>Twirai etc. These rivers flows from the Uttrakhand to North Bengal in sequences.
Anthropological evidences:
There are many ethnological evidences that there was once habitation of Borok or Kirata race in the Indus valley. If through research and search are being carried out, there will be definite traces of Borok race in the Pakistan around the Indus area even now. The Kinnours, Lahuli etc. are still living in the Himachal Pradesh, who are none but Tibeto-Burman origin and are the people of Borok race who were left back at the time of migration. Similarly there are Rungsa who are still living in the Pithoragarh district of Uttaranchal whose mother tongue had been clubbed with Tripura language in the 1991 census and who claim to be Tibeto-Burman descendant. This Rungsa is none but the previous form of Reangsa of Tripuri Sub-tribe, who were left behind at the times of migration. There are many small tribes of Tibeto-burman Kirata race who are scattered in the Himalayan region.
Route of migration of Kirata people in the Indian continent:
From the Dadiwan area of China a group migrated to head water of Yangtze river around 7000 years ago. Then our ancestors migrated from this Yangtze river head to the site of Indus or Chindi river valley through Khyber pass around 6000 years ago, that is 4000 BC and founded the Indus valley civilization along with Proto-australoid and Mediterranean people. This civilization flourished between 4000-1900 BC. The Kirata or indo-mongoloid might have been the ruler of sindhu civilization as history proves that mongoloid race founded most of mighty empire in the past. When the Aryan nomadic tribes invaded Indus valley riding on the horse, the Borok race could not resist them and had to migrate towards the east along the path of sub-Himalyan region. Where as the Dravidian migrated to the south and the Australoid migrated to the east and middle of India. The Borok or Kirata migrated through Punjab, Jammu, Delhi, Himachal Pradesh, Uttaranchal, Nepal, north Bengal, Assam, Dimapur, Kachhar and finally reached in the present state of Tripura 1400 years ago, and then up to Coast of Bay of Bengal at Chittagong hill tract. On the way of migration many tribes were left behind who in the course of time formed a distinct tribes, but there linguistic and ethnic relation still exist. The descendant of kirata/Borok race are Sunuwar,rai,limbu,yakha,Kinnours, Rungsa, Koch, Mech, Hajong, Rabha, Bodo, Garo, Tiwas, Chutia, Karbi, Dimasa, Kachhari, and Tripuri. Another Antropology evidence is One group of kirata people Migrated from Hunan provience of china through upper course of yantse king river and Western Whwang ho river to Straight down to Assam valley and they start to rule from there and One Branch of kirata start to migrate through western Himalayas and came to Nepal and after many centaury of ruling they became SUNUWAR,RAI,AND LIMBU. Actually SUNUWAR itself was Rai. Rai is not clan name this was common name or title of the middle and the western kiranti people of nepal but sunuwar changed itself from Rai Title to sunuwar it’s not been long. Still sunuwar is called rai or khambu.Sunuwar people they changed from rai to sunuwar because they wanted to show superiority than rai and limbu.Friest of all they start to Adopt bramhan as their guru and later they were put in Title of namasine jati but not for the rai and limbu.This was Aryan conspiration in nepal for how to divide kiranti in eastern nepal.
Kirata in Ancient Religious Text, Epic and Mythology:
Rajmala mentions that Tripuri used to be known as Kirata in older times. The root word of Kirata is not clear, it may be Kwrak, meaning strong, or Kirithaya>Kiritya>Kirata what is fearless. Kirata is mentioned in the Yajur and Atharva Veda. Similarly the Kirata is mentioned along with Huna, Andhra, Pulinda, Pulkasa, Abhira, Sumbha, Yavana, members of the Khasa races in Srimad Bhagavatam. The Kirata is mentioned in the Ramayan in Ayodhya kanda’s sarga 15 section, with their hair tied up in knots, shining like gold and pleasant to look upon, bold enough to move under water, terrible, veritable tiger-men, so are they famed. Similarly Kirata tribe was mentioned in Mahabharata on the Vanaparva section 39. The Kirata had been described as golden yellow people which are the skin color of modern Tripuri,sunuwar,rai,limbu though over the thousand of year of living in present Tripura the colour had changed more yellow to Dark golden.Even though we kirata and Chinese were the same race present day of kirata are not golden yellowy like Chinese people because of our geography,food style etc. One of the most skill full archer of that time Eklabya was none than a Kirata, Bhima’s wife Hadimba was a Kirata women and Ghototkoch of Mahabharata was a Kirata king, apart from the facts mentioned in the Rajmala that Tripuri kirant king Trilochana had participated in the mythological Kurukshetra war.
Gods of Hindu Religion:
The gods most widely worshipped and celebrated to day in India are, 1) Shiva and in his various forms and manifestations. 2) Parvati and her various forms and manifestation. 3) Children of Shiva and Parvati, they are (i) Lakshmi, (ii) Saraswati (iii) Ganesh (ivy) Kartika 4) Vishnu and his various incarnations. 5) Various Guru as Demi-gods who are considered as incarnation or birth of different gods.
Vishnu is considered by the scholars as the originally god of Dravidian people and have derived from word ‘Vin’ who was god of sun and sky of Dravidian. He was mentioned in the later book of Rig-Veda, when he was accepted in the Vedic faiths.
Gods of Indus civilisation:
The most important archeological finding of Harappa gods is Pashupati, an image of god seated with buffalo, tiger, elephant deer etc, with head gear made of buffalo horn. He is identified with the present day Hindu god Shiva. There were also female gods’ terracotta and images found in the excavation of Indus civilisation. These are the gods of Indus people that used to be worshipped during Indus civilisation.
There are many places in the north India and sub-Himalayan area whose names are indication that the area had once been inhabited by the Indo-mongoloid races ‘Bodo/borok’ branch. Prof. Suniti Kr. Chatterjee in his famous book of Kirat-Jana-Kriti mentioned that there was a city of Kiradu, now ruined, with its 27 temple in the western border of Rajasthan near the Indus civilization site. It means that the city was inhabited and founded by Kirata people. There was also a hamlet named ‘hathma’ or ‘hatma’ meaning wide land in Tripuri language, suggestive of Boro/k people’s inhabitation in the Indus valley region. The capita city of India, Delhi is also considered to be derivatives of Kirata /Borok word dwi-lili>Dilli. There are plenty of similar examples in Assam like Dibrugor, Dihong, Digboi Dimapur, and many more.
Aryan Invaded Indus Civilization:
The Aryan invaded India some time around 1700 BC, the Indus civilization ruined around same time. There were plenty of examples that the Aryan destroyed the Indus civilization and plundered the citizens, the Australoid, mongoloid of Indus valley. There are several wars mentioned in Rig-Veda, Indra was the strongest king of Aryan who destroyed many forts, so he was termed as Purander in Veda. The excavation of Mahenjo-daro and Harappa had discovered many of human skeleton buried in one place indicate that these people were buried in one place after being killed. Finding of skeleton of children further confirms that Indus civilization was plundered and destroyed by external enemy. So the citizen of Indus valley i.e., the Austric race was forced to migrate to wards east and middle of India, Dravidian in the south and the Mongoloid in the north and north east of India.
Sanskrit name in Mythology:
Most of the names of mythological period were meaning less even in Sanskrit. Many Bodo wards have been absorbed in Sanskrit and Sanskritised like, Towi(Twi), Bokkho(bwkha), Ling(lwi), Ahong(Ang) ma(ma means no) Mukkho(mwkhang) Samudru (som-dru) Raja (Rai-cha>raja, becoming head of tribes) and the list goes on. The following words seems like more of the Kirata origin, like the Daksh, Yayati, Druhyu, Nahus, Ayu, Babhru, Brisaparva, Drun, Kunti, Dhrupati, etc. These names indicates that it had been corrupted form the Borok/Bodo words to suite the Aryan tongue. So the mythological and historical person were of Borok kirant race.
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Who are Chandra dynasty descendant?
It is generally known that Chandra was a Aryan king and the modern days Rajputs of north India are the descendant of the king Chandra. But we have to trace the root scientifically with available historical records and explain it logically.
1) It is accepted by the historian fraternity that the Mahabharata war occurred around 1400 BC. Yudhisthir was the king from Pandav and the king of Tripura participated in favour of Duryudhan. According to Rajmala records King Trilochana or Subrai is contemporary of Yudhisthir. He is 47th in succession from Chandra; Yudhisthir was also around the same in the in succession from Chandra. If we take average 25 years of generation age then 46X25=1150 years. Now 1400+1150=2550 years that is king Chandra was ruling India around 2250BC. On the contrary it is historical fact that the Aryan came in India between 1700-1500 BC, so there was no Aryan before 1700 BC in India, than how can the Chandra be Aryan king?? That means Chandra was non-Aryan king, not as claimed most of people.
2) On the other side, the Rajputs as we know today are descendent of Scythic tribes, who came from central Asia and invaded India around 400 BC. Mulchand Chauhan, in the book of ‘Scythic origin of Rajputs Race’ stated taking the reference of ethnographer Col Todd “It is a singular fact that there is no available date beyond the 4th century for any of the great Rajput families, all of whom are brought from the North. This was the period of one of the grand irruptions of the Getic races from Central Asia-’. So the present Rajputs of Rajasthan and other Kshatriya can not be the descendant of Chandra who ruled India 2550 BC. On the contrary the ancestor of Tripuri king, Chandra who was there at around to be a Kirata king is plausible from the evidences and the historical facts avail able with us.
3) Origin of word Chandra: It is a proven fact that many Kirata words had been Sanskritised and absorbed in the pool of Sanskrit word. For example one of the synonyms for water in Sanskrit is Towi, which is Bodo/borok word origin. There are many words absorbed but needs to be researched. There is one more example how indo-mongoloid name had been changed to Sanskrit name. The famous Kushanas kings were Mongoloid Yueh-chi tribe form frontier of China, which had been Sanskritised from Kuei-shang>Kushan in India. The mightiest dynasty of India Mughal derived its name from Mongol (Persian Mughal), Sukrai Ochai converted to Sukracharya. Similarly the original Sanskrit meaning of the word Chandra is “big bright and luminous” which in Tripuri language is “chwngtor” means moon which is bright big and luminus. This kokborok word “chwngtor” for moon had been modified to ‘chandro’, and absorbed into Sanskrit for moon, Chwnngtoro>Chongdro> Chandra. It is from this kokborok kirat word the chandro word had been taken in sanskrit and the dyanasty of Chandra had started form this kokborok word.
4) Pandavs were Mongoloid. The claim of Pandav and Kaurav as Aryan descendant is a doubtful illogical arguments, rather favour to be mongoloid origin. 1) Polyandry among Pandav (a women having many husbands) was not common among Aryans, not found in any other history or mythology. But it is very common and still in practice among the Kinnours, Lahuli, and Spitian Drukpa Himalayan mongoloid tribes. 2) Bhima drank blood of Dushasan is suggestive of barbarian mongoloid. 3) Kunti>Kungti, Dhrupati>Durupti are suggestive of Borok/ Bodo name like Kosomti, Kufuti, Chikonti, Khumbati etc. 4) A Mongolian tribe in the Himachal Pradesh clams to be descendant of Duryudhan 5) After the war the Pandavs went to heaven where a dog is supposed to have lead them, indicating by that their home was at Himalayan hills. When they go to SWARGA DHARI to go swarg they went nepal still you can see SWARGA DWARI in MANANG and MUSTANG.The Pandav were supposed to have been burnt in Laksha Griha which is nothing but thatch which is abundant in hill region of Himalaya, that means they were inhabited some where in Himalayan. So these facts prove that the war of Mahabharata was between Mongoloid brothers.Arjuna married with naga kiranti lady of manipur. Mahabharata tradition of being the seat of the Naga king Citravahana, whose daughter Citrangada was married with arjuna.Arjunas another wife was also naga kiranti lady whose name was Ulupi.how come he married kiranti lady when he was Aryan in that time?Same thing Bhima’s wife was Hadimba who was kiranti lady.He too why he need to marry kirant lady not marrying Aryan lady?Same thing Ghatotkacha of Mahabharata fame (Son of Bhima) was a Kirata Chieftain that means father himself was kiranta origion just Aryan people hijacked them as Aryan.
Still most of the hilly mongoloied tribe worship PANCH PANDAV in many different way.Almost every kiranti village has vimsen than{vimsen temple}and when the pandav fight and travel all the places were in kirant deshe or hilly region like KICHAK BAD which bhima killed kichak was place in jhapa in nepal same thing Mahabharata war itself happen in kirat deshe in land of kirant.Normally when the kiranti people worship Bhima they offer sacrifice of BUFFALLO AND GOATS.If he was Aryan Bramhin or chetri He not suppose to offer Buffalo sacrifice because they don’t eat buffalo in their culture.There is still Mahavarata hill in nepal where the place is densely populated by kirata.so it can prove that this is war between mongoloied kings.
The Origin of Shiva:
The word Shiva has root in the Kirata or Borok race, not in the Vedas becaugse Shiva as god is not mentioned in it Rather mentioned as simple kirant god,destructive of Aryan and animal. Shiva is hybrid of two Kirata words, simani means Gyan or knowledge and Kaiba, means five, i.e. Si+Ba=Siba>Siva>Sibarai>Sibrai . That means a god who has knowledge of five elements of life, that is earth, fire, water, air, and sky, that is cosmic rays which forms the life. That is one who has created life in this world or creator of life in the world. Other meaning can be one who made us perceive or feel five senses in our body, that is who is the soul of the boy. It is this Sibrai converted to Shivai in Sanskrit. From this five shiva is said to have five face and named as “Panchanan.”
In Bodo culture he is known as Bathubrai, meaning king of collection of five elements of earth, fire, water, air and sky, that means creator, the supreme god. The other meaning can apply in this case also. So the god Shiva is originally god of Borok/ Kirata race not that of Aryan or Dravidian.
The other name of Mahadev is direct translation of Mutai kotor, the supreme god of Tripuri people and first among the fourteen gods. The mutai kotor or Subrai is considered as supreme creator of this universe and the life in the earth in the mythology of Tripuri people. This fact had been finally accepted in the Indian mythology and Shiva had been placed above the Vishnu and Brahma of trinity gods.
Feature of Shiva the Creator:
1) His home or abode is in the Himalaya only, namely Amarnath, Badrinath, Hardwar, Kedaranath, Kailash mansarover and many more. It is again home of Kirata or borok race.
2) Fond of wine, ganja, dhatura who remains intoxicated most of time.
3) Fond of meat and non-vegeterean foods.
4) He is half naked, wearing skin of tiger in the loin only, rudraskha or dudrai mala in neck.
5) Living with Snakes and other animals.
6) His symbol is crescent moon, a symbol of Chandra dynasty, Trishul in hand.
7) He is wandering god, living with different ghost in the cremation ground; body is smeared with ash of cremation.
9) He is short tempered, mighty, courageous, does not think of consequences, destructives.
10) Easily convincible, compassionate, merciful, big hearted as termed Ashutosh or Bholenath which is nature of kirant.
11) Living with wife, who is Parvati or Haichwkma, goddess of Hill.
12) His animal carrier was originally buffalo, which was later converted to Ox by Aryan people, as found in Indus valley. The buffalo is still the carrier of Shiva in Tibet, China, and Japan proves that it was originally of Kirata god.
13) Worshiped by offering wine, animal sacrifice, and water is poured in the Shiva linga.
All the above feature of the Shiva suggest that he was the god of Kirata race initially but later modified to suit the Aryan faith or belief. And he was termed as one of the Hindu god and his carrier animal had been changed from buffalo to ox.
Origin of Shiva Ling:
There are many explanation of origin of the Shiva linga worshipping and the origin of word linga. But none of the explanation given in the Puran convincing and logical. On the other hand if we explain according to Tripuri custom and belief it can be explained for both. The Kirata are not expert in making idol and never worshipped idol so also the Aryan are. In ancient time people used to worship small linga shaped stone symbolizing as god Shiva specially in the jungle. They used to pour water, sacrificed animals in front of it and smear blood on it. This is still in practice in Tripura among the Tripuri people. This stone is represented as image of Shiva among Tripuri. Such type of example is one Holong mutai in west Tripura interior hill of Boromura. It is very popular and lots of devotee of Tripuri people pay visit every year.
This Holong is pronounces as Hlong in Riang dialect and was also among other Tripuri people in the past three thousand years ago. This word hlong is converted to hlong>hling> ling in later period by the Aryans to suit their tongue. This way Shiva had been worshiped in the form of shiv-ling by Aryans, which was nothing but Holong mutai representing Shiva of Borok race.
Other thing kirata were nature worshiper and they used to worship linga and yoni since ancient time so it can prove that linga and yoni worship religion is kirant religion because noble truth is that without linga and yoni there is no creation so aryans accepted this and involve in their religion.
Other name of Shiva:
Shiva has many name, one such name is Kirateshwar means god of Kirat people, so it also proves that Shiva is god of kirant race. His another name is ‘Hor’, it does not have meaning in Sanskrit other than to steal, where as it has a most significant and powerful meaning as ‘fire’ which lord Shiva appropriately deserves, as he is the most powerful like fire, from which these universe had been created. The slogan raised for him as “Hor-hor Bhom-bhom” has no literal meaning in Indian languages, but it has the meaning full explanation in Tripuri language, as big burning flames of fire! One more name is Tripureshwar, meaning god of Tripura. The other name is Tripurari, which means killer of Tripur. According to Rajmala and mythology also the king Tripur of Tripura was killed by Shiva, so he is termed as Tripurari or enemy of Tripur. All these facts indicate that Shiva was in fact god of Kirata, god of Hindu origin not the Aryan Vedic god. Even in Bed very beginning he was mentioned as simple god of kirata and who bring the pain in animals and destructive force who can travel in air but later he is promoted as MAHADEVA in PURANIC time.
The origin of Parvati:
The goddess Parvati had been directly translated from the Kirata of Borok word Haichwk ma or the goddess of hills, and accordingly worshipped by the Aryan. This goddess is also not mentioned in the Vedas either in name or in any of its form. It purely represents the goddess of Kirata race. In the mythology of Parvati’s birth had been described in many ways, and none is convincing and are contradictory each other. So it clearly proves that Parvati was not goddess of Aryan people but originally goddess of Borok kirant race.
According to Tripuri mythology, she lives in the hill and owner of hill and hills belonging including the animals. She keeps animal under her custody and domestic animals including human are not excluded from it. If she desires so she can take away any animal and human and hide it from owner, which she releases only after receiving offers. She is also the Kamlapati in the famous Boro Kwina ni mutai. Again she is also considered as the consort of lord Shiva who is almighty owner of universe. The same is described in the main land Hindu mythology.
Abode of Parvati:
According to the Tripuri mythology and faith she lives in the jungle and all the high hills. She is worshipped in the jungle only even today. The same theory is found among the main land Hindu also. Where as no Aryan prefers to live in the hill or jungle, where as the Kirata loves to live in jungle and the hill times since immemorial and their god and goddess are always considered to be hill and jungle dweller, so is the goddess of Parvati and Shiva. Parvati or the Vaishnu devi home is none other than in the peak of Himalaya. Other than this different manifestation of Parvati’s and her temple like Chamunda, Hadimba, Tripura Sundari and many more are situated in the hills of Himalaya. These facts clearly prove that Parvati was originally goddess of Kirata and later absorbed in to the main Hindu fold.
Other name of Parvati:
One of the several names of Parvati is Kirati, which means goddess of Kirata people. The other name given was Kiratini again means that Parvati or Durga is goddess of Kirata origin. After giving athese many examples there can not exist any doubt the Kirata origin of Parvati.Parvatis father was HIMALAYA That time only kirata people used to live in Himalayan slope.We can find story in SWASTHANI BRATA KATHA which siba and parvati having disguise themselves as KIRANT AND KIRANTNI and living in SLESH MANTAK BAN IN PASHUPATINATH.That means they were pure kiranti origion whatever the Aryan people did for change her as Aryan god it cannot work and hide from being kiranti.
Manifestation as Uma:
One of the names of Parvati is Uma. This name is also not mentioned in any of the Vedas. So it is not the vedic goddess. The origin and the birth of word Uma is also full of conflicting and contradictory in the Purana. But it is very clear according to Tripuri faith and mythology. The goddess of earth or the state is termed as Ama by us, meaning by my mother goddess. The Tripureshwari Goddess is called as simply Ama or sakani ama that mother of south. This word Ama had been corrupted to Ama>Uma by the Aryan and symbolized with Parvati. It is so simple, logical and rational to explain rather than taking tortuous route. Also CHANDI DEVI is another form of durga or parvati is considered mighty kiranti lady still chandi is main deity of kiranti people specially SUNUWAR AND RAI.
Origin of goddess Durga:
Like the origin and explanation of all of the gods and goddess of Hindu in the Puran are contradictory and conflicting, this one is also facing the same. Neither of the explanation is satisfactory. She had not been mentioned in the Vedas and not worshipped during the vedic period. So she is also the goddess of Kirata people. There is one interesting fact to note that, one small idol of Goddess Tripureshwari is placed just on left side of main idol even now. This idol used to be carried out at the time of war by the commanders and placed first in the fort or durgo in the war field. She was first worshipped and then preceded for war. So she is the protector of durgo, from this durgo the ward and form of Durga had come into being in modern day.
First Celebration of Durga:
Durga puja in the modern form was first celebrated by Koch king Kongsha Narayan in the 16th century, who was descendant of Borok race. Similarly there is a Durga mandir in the Dimapur which was built by the Dimasa King. The Tripura king had their Durga mandir near their palace since the ancient time. There were many coins of Tripura kings discovered with Durga image proves that it was goddess of Tripuri people. First the image of Durga was found in the coins of Kushan or Kuei-shang king dating back to 1st century AD. It was later found in subsequent kings. So Durga was goddess of the Kirata or Borok kings and Borok race in name & form, a goddess of war and victory, which was later accepted by the people of other races.According to religion book Once Rakshasas ruled Heaven{mountain kingdom like KASHMIRE,NEPAL ETC}and sacked INDRA AND OTHER DEV Aryan people.Their leader was MAHISHASHUR who came to fight with riding on MAHISH[buffaloo}.Later who was killed by goddess DURGA Kiranti lady In favour of aryans.It seems aryans always succeed to use kiranti people even in past.They worship kirant god SIVA,DURGA,CHANDI,KALI but ignore other kirant people and decendent of these god and goddest.Probaly mahishashur itself must be kirata or other mongoloied tribe because this kind of buffalo riding things done in southern china,Vietnam,Cambodia and other mongoloied country OR it must be someone aborigional people like astro-Asiatic people or Dravidian people.There is 100%sure durga is not god of Aryan.When they go to ask for the help of god siva Aryan deva were seems using unbelievable words which mahadev can’t say no himself even he knows dev Aryans were wrong for war.Such flattering word like “HARE MAHADEV,TRI LOK ADHI PATI,KARUNA KO KHANI DAYAKO SAGAR,ANTARYAMI,JYOTIRNA MAYA SAKTI,TRINETRA DHARI,PRAVUKO HAMI TUCHCHA PRANI CHARAN KAMALMA CHAU HAMI,RAKSHA GARA HEY BHOLE BOM”Because of this kind of highly flatterable word made him compelled to Help them.Still the chetri and bramhin people use this kind of dirty and flattering word when they need something from others like saying “RAJA,PRABHU,DARSHAN HAJUR”This kind of word is not perfect for to use ordinary people like darshan suppose to use for god.In Very beginning in Veda Aryan mention him as ordinary kirant god but later promoted him as supreme god of all in puranic time because of his power.Some example like in veda mentioning like this {BHASMESWORE KIRATA DEVA,PASHUMA HANI PURAUNE,VAYUMA BICHARAN GARNE,TRASKO DEVATA,PISHACHA,MANAV MA DUKHA LEWNE—-In Translation it says god of destroyer,horror who bring pain in animal and human who travel in air like dark cloud}You know such hates horror god of Aryan later promoted as mahadeva,kalyan kari,trilok adhipati{god of heaven earth and hell} how funny is that how can they changed their tune.It prove they are opportuniest.
Origin of Kali:
The origin of kali in name and form has come from the Borok people, but again hijacked by Bengali. The kali had derived from the word swkal or witch. It is pronounced as Skali in Riang dialect. Skali is later on corrupted from Skali>kali to kali in Sanskrit. An evil spirit swkal when takes refuge in women is called as Swkal, and when takes to man he is known as Beduwa. Swkal is again considered as consort of Burasa mutai, an evil form of Subrai. That is why she is worshipped or offered in the night, in the jungle only. For this reason we find the attire of kali with garland of human head, waist cloths of arms, with sword, drinking human blood, and protruded out tongue, which symbolizes imagination of our Swkal.Kali is wife of siva and another form of Parvati.Parvati has too many forms like durga,chandi,kali,kapali,vadrakali,chada,munda everything.It clearly prove that kali is kiranti goddess not Aryan.
Origin of Laksmi:
The goddess Laksmi is also did not find any place in the sacred text of Vedas. It had been mentioned as adjective to describe, not as goddess. It had derived from Kirata goddess of Mailuma in form who is goddess of rice and wealth in form. On the word form it had derived from Noksuma, here letter N is replaced with L that is common in Aryan language, like Nimbu=Lembu, Lon(take)=Nin. So Noksuma>Loksuma>Loksma> Loksmi, where as it retained the form of goddess of Mailuma. As such the rice was grain of Kirata race, who brought while migrating from china, where it was first discovered by Chinese people, so the concept of Goddess of rice given to Laksmi favours of Kirata race.
Origin of Saraswati:
This is the only goddess found in the Vedas and found to be origin of Aryan people. But again its form has been totally changed form its earlier form. It was mentioned in two meaning, one as river one as goddess. Sarswati in the Vedas was goddess of wealth, fruits and well being not as goddess of learning and intelligence. Sarswati to day is clothed with white color which had derived from Khuluma of Tripuri people who is goddess of cotton and learning as she teaches us to weave and design the clothes. Khuluma is considered white color as she for cotton.
Origin of Manasa:
Goddess manasa was not mentioned in Vedas like all the Hindu gods, she is mentioned only in the latter part of purana, some where in 15th century. She derived form the goddess noksuma of Tripuri people, but here she got the form and the meaning of Noksuma unlike laskmi who go only the name. she is goddess of snake like noksuma of Tripuris. The letter N of Noksuma inter changes with the last letter M and K is deleted. So naksuma>mansama>mansa. Mansa is goddess of snake in main land Hindu simmilarly the Noksuma is goddess of snake among the Tripuri people.
Origin of Lord Ganesh:
He is described as son of Shiva and Parvati, so he is none but mongoloid god. His name and form is also absent in the Vedas, that means he is not the Aryan god. It most likely represents the god Goria of Tripuri people. The other name of ganesh is Binayak, on the other hand baba Goria is worhipped as Binairok by the Ochai. This shows that the Goria and the Gonesh is same in the past. The knot tied at the end of Risa for holding paddy, cotton, flower etc was misinterpreted as trunk of elephant, so the ganesh head is considered as to be of elephant. These way, binairok became binayak and goria>gonesh. As Baba Goria is god of wealth, production, benevolent, and for the welfare the lord ganesh is also considered in the same meaning in main land Hinduism. So the Goria being transformed in to ganesh is the fact.
Origin of Kartik:
Kartik is younger brother of Ganesh, and son of shiv and durga, there by he is god of Kirata people by birth. His name is also not mentioned in the Vedas, so he is not god of Aryan people. According to Tripuri mythology, god Kalia is younder brother of Goria, he is also god of welbeing. In the course of cultural synthesis during puranic period this kalia had been transformed in to Kartik is quite possible.
Not Believing the Facts Above:
If the above mentioned facts are not convincing and finding difficult to digest and not easily going up to our brain, then look at the following facts:
1) The Tripureshwari Temple of Udaipur is built by King Dhanya Manikya in the year 1500 AD. But now it is mentioned in the Puran and described this temple as part of 51 pitha where Parvati’s right foot is considered to have fallen when her body was cut into 51 pieces by sudrashan charka. Then, is this true to the historical facts of Tripura?
2) The 14 gods of Kharchi are all Gods of Tripuri people and are named according to kokborok in the past. Rajmala compilers like Kailash Chandra had clearly mentioned that these were none but translated to Sanskrit, though retaining the same meaning.
3) The Kamakhya Temple of Guwahati was built by Koch king (Borok race) in the end of 13th century, but this is again included in the list of 51 pitha where Parvati’s private part is considered to have fallen, where as truth is other way round!
These bramhin people were so opportuniest and champion for to make false story which can be benefit for them like BUDHANIL KANTHA OF NEPAL They made unnecessary folk tale about it saying it was found by one local farmer when he dug the peddy plot and toe of bisnu had cut of during digging and blood start to came out side and blood start to flow everywhere.The poor peasant so horrified and asked for forgive since then all people start to worship and King shouldn’t go there to see budhanilkantha if he go will die because once when king been there lots of naga came to kill him.This is folk tale which bramhin people put illusion for uneducated people but if we see in scientific ground it was Made by JISNU GUPTA during lichivi period.Same thing GAUTAM BUDDHA who was fighting whole of his life against this Bramhan culture touchable and untoucheble they seize opportunity and put him 9th incarnation of god bishnu.This is completely redicules and opportuniest behavior.It means Aryan can do anything if it benefit them.Doesn’t matter true or false.There is one folk lore about bramhin.Once priest bramhin was about to eat rice pudding one white colour of dog came and eat it the rice.Bramhin is so shoked eat or not to eat.If he eat other people will hate him if don’t eat this is rice pudding.He was so greedy then he off sudden made slok saying Black dog is bad and white dog is very good.He said this and rushed to eat rice pudding that means for them black can be white,white can be black For us is after all dog is dog whatever the colour is.
So what is your Religion?
Now going through the historical facts mentioned above who are the original Hindu? Are we Kirata or those invaders Aryan? What are their gods they brought along with them and listed in the Vedas? What are the gods images found in the Indus valley? What are our traditional and mythological gods?
Who have converted to Hindu to whom? Did the Aryan convert us to Hindu? Or we Borok (Kirata) converted Aryans to Hindu?
Who had stopped worshipping their gods? Is it Borok or Aryan? Who had lost their culture? Is it Borok or Aryan?
They claim our civilzatiiion is their civilization and our religion is their religion.This is 21st centuary History must rewrite.
So my fellow kiranti people there is no cause to feel inferior or to feel that Hindu are not we or gods of Hindu are not ours. There is no reason to search for BETTE R GOD and BETTER RELIGION. No logic to through your OWN RELIGION & GOD. All the India’s religion, culture and land belong to you since 6000 years. The earth, water, fire, air, and sky of India are also yours, as it had been of your ancestors for thousands of years ago.
dilip said
In addition, here’s the link which support that Hinduism originated from Kirant religion:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirant_Mundhum
Practices:
Kirats practice shamanism and their rituals are mostly related to the worship of mother nature and ancestors. Almost all sacred rituals are performed by nakchong, the kirat priest.
Their supreme deity Tagera Nyingmaphuma is personified as Lord Shiva.[19]
Many followers wear a tilak on the forehead, as in Hinduism, when they recite their sacred text, the Kiranti Veda.[20]
Festivals:
Sakela is the main festival of Kirat which is celebrated twice a year distinguished by two names Ubhauli and Udhauli. Sakela Ubhauli is celebrated during Baisakh Purnima (full moon day, which lies in the month of Baisakh in calenders of the Indian Subcontinent.) and Sakela Udhauli is celebrated during the full moon day in the month of Mangshir. Sakela celebration is the prayer to Goddess of Nature for good crops and protection from natural calamities.
The celebration of Sakela is also known as Chandi Nach. On Chandi Nach, they worship Durga, who is known to them as Chandi, or Chandika.[21] (Worship of Durga among the Himalayan Kiratas is written in the Harivamsha Purana.[22]) Durga Puja is performed by them.[23]
Tihar is another festival that was added first in the Veda. It is also known as Deepavali and Lakshmi Puja.[24]
Shravan is another festival.
work reference:
19. P. 107 Politics of Culture:A study of three Kirata communities in the Eastern Himalayas by T.B. Subba
20. ^ P. 282 Patrika: Newsletter of the Indian Academy of Sciences By Vivekananda Kendra, Indian Academy of Sciences
21. ^ P. 76 Kiratas in Ancient India By G. P. Singh, Dhaneswar Kalita, V Sudarsen, M A Kalam
22. ^ P. 195 Ancient Communities of the Himalaya By Dinesh Prasad Saklani
23. ^ P. 108 Politics of Culture:A study of three Kirata communities in the Eastern Himalayas by T.B. Subba
24. ^ P. 108 Politics of Culture:A study of three Kirata communities in the Eastern Himalayas by T.B. Subba
It’s no doubt that Kirat civilization as of 2009, is 5069 years is the oldest in an Indian sub-continent and any customs, rituals, practices are directly or indirectly associated with kiratas.
Kiratas has played a great role in shaping the history of ancient India both geographically and in terms of religious and customs but only now are we seeing the truth revolving Hinduism and its festivals, all crediting to the great scholars Indian and foreign.
G.P Singh in his book “The Kiratas in Ancient India” 1990,
quoted this from the ancient work of India,
“those who are braves cannot be extinguish” referring to KIRATAS.
Therefore even after all these centuries of bringing people into the fold of Brahmanisms through Hinduism, the Kiratas has still keep their belief and culture intact though they have lost many original practices due to the modification(Hinduism).
barunroy said
Dear Mr. Dilip,
I have no doubt about the greatness of the Tripuri People, in fact I have great many friends there and take pride in calling Mr. Pradyot Deb Burman, the King of Tripura as a personal friend. I only was questioning your sources, Sir, not you. Please do not misunderstand me. I have been myself researching on Kirata history and I have gone through these sites but they do not quote an historical references. If Mahabharata is saying ‘this’ then certainly we must ask which book, which paragraph and which line?
Regs
Barun
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Malati Khambu said
Hello dilip ji,
What nice article you have found it really blow my brain and wake me up in sense of who we are.Please keep go on like this.
dilip said
Well though more people are educated have access to more information.
It’s only matter of time before th truth will come to light.
It’s just that for couple of hundred years, our ancestors who were simple and straight-forward were easily manipulated with lies.
For your information, Chandi dance(Sakewa/sakela) is the worshiping and giving thanks to mother Goddess
Uma, who came down as Chandika(Durga) to help the people get rid of evil demon Mahishasura.
Note to be taken. According to the book “Devī Māhātmya”(“Glory of the Goddess”) by Coburn, Thomas B, it is striking that the word Chandika has virtually no earlier history in Sanskrit. “There are no instances of its occurrence in the Vedic literature we have surveyed. The epics are similarly barren: neither the Ramayana nor the Mahabharata give evidence of the epithet, although in one of the hymns inserted in the latter Canda and Candi are applied to the deity they praised.”
I don’t know how many lies can they(Brahamins) come out with and how many Truths can they hide.
The word ‘Rai’ is suffixed in Borok languages in the end of most of the male offspring name, specially those who are very strong, stout and masculine.
For example: Kufu-rai, Kwchak-rai, Suku-rai>Sukrai, Budu-rai, Sukundrai, Tokhi-rai, Wakhi-rai etc.
Kirant Rai people worship Nature(serpeants,trees, stones, etc) and ancestors, Animism and Shamanism, believing in a their primeval ancestors Sumnima-Paruhang (Uma-Siva).
Lord Siva is the greatest God of Tripuri(Borok) people. He is also known as Sibrai.
According to Tripuri mythology, Lord Sibrai is creator of this universe. He only created this earth, its five elements of life that is earth, water, fire, air and sky.
That is why he is known as Siba meaning creator of five elements Si=Knowledge, ba=five
Siva is hybrid of two Kirata words, simani means Gyan or knowledge and Kaiba, means five, i.e.
Si+Ba=Siba>Siva>Sibarai>Sibrai. That means a god who has knowledge of five elements of life, that is earth, fire, water, air, and sky, that is cosmic rays which forms the life.
So the word Siva is basically derived form Borok/Kirata word of Sibrai. Many historical records and mythological facts reveals that Sibrai or Siva was originally a Tripuri vis-a-vis Kirata people’s original God, which later had been adopted by non-Kirata people of India, and its mythology re-written.
Malati Khambu said
Dilip ji,
Thanks for your reseach we must change our histry and status of our country i mean status of kiranti in nepal.According to this article i felt my eyes are opened and knew how this aryan people are making fool to us but hopefully not anymore.
RAJA said
Now this kiratis (a nepali clan) are illegally claiming hindu God Lord shiva was only their GOD and later others hindu started worshipping of Lord shiva …..
patleybaskounpad said
why don’t you sue them Raja..
dilip said
Usually when crime is committed, a trace of evidence is left behind.
The following praise to Lord Shiva and Parvati from one of the veda scripts is a revelation to behold.
Om Namah Sivaya Kirataya
Om Namah Umayai Sabaryai
upon transaltion is;
“Om! Salutation to Siva, the all good, the Kirata!
“Om! Salutation to Uma, the mother, the Sabari!
Arya-Dramida-Nasida-Kiratanam krtir hi ya;
Sveta-tamrasita-svarna caher-varnya-mayi hita;
rsibhir brahmanair dista jina-buddhadi-desita,
vibhinna-ruchi-hrdya ca ricitra-patha-hetutah,
sarva-devatmika nitya jira-brahmaikya-bhavani,
sarvam-saha dharitriva sarva-vaha sanatami.
dharma-mitir Bharatiya nitya-satyasya siddhaye
sarva-lokasya sada syadd hitaya ca sukhaya ca,
vibudhanam prasadaya prey ase sreyase’ pi ca.
sva-karma-niratah sarve caranto dharma-desanam
himsa-lobha-vihinasca bhavantu sukhinah sada.
And this is quite a high exaltation of the status for the non-Aryan hill people, when the scriptures from the vedic literature solely reveal the true identity of Siva and Uma.
Note to be taken. The word Siva and Sabari is of non-aryan origin.
As already proven that the word Siva is hybrid of two Kirata words, simani means Gyan
or knowledge and Kaiba, means five, i.e.
Si+Ba=Siba>Siva>Sibarai>Sibrai. That means a god who has knowledge of five elements of life,
that is earth, fire, water, air, and sky, that is cosmic rays which forms the life. Many historical
records and mythological facts reveals that Sibrai or Siva was originally a Tripuri vis-a-vis Kirata people’s original God, which later had been adopted by non-Kirata people of India, and its
mythology re-written.
The Tripuri (Tipra or Tipperah) people are the original inhabitants of the Kingdom of Tripura in North-East India and Bangladesh. The Tripuri people through the Royal family of the Debbarmas
ruled the Kingdom of Tripura for more than 2000 years till the kingdom joined the Indian
Union in 1949.
The Tripuri people are considered part of the Tibeto-Burmese ethnic group. Originally they migrated from near the upper courses of the Yangtze kiang and the Hwang Ho rivers in Western China.
The common reference to these people as “Kiratas” and “Cinas” in the early Sanskrit texts of India unmistakably indicates that they came down to the Assam valley long before the dawn of Christian era.
Manifestation as Uma:
One of the names of Parvati is Uma. This name is also not mentioned in any of the Vedas. The origin and the birth of word Uma is also full of conflicting and contradictory in the Purana. But it is very clear
according to Tripuri faith and mythology. The Tripureshwari Goddess is called as simply Ama or sakani ama that mother of south. This word Ama had been corrupted to Ama>Uma and
symbolized with Parvati.
The other name of Parvati is known as Kiratini, Chandika but is more well known as Durga
which has all its roots as non-aryan origin.
Hence still today Rai people of Kirat family still worship and thanks Kiratini, Chandika as Durga
in a form of Chandi dance.
According to the book “Devi Mahatmya”(“Glory of the Goddess”) by Coburn, Thomas B,
it is striking that the word Chandika has virtually no earlier history in Sanskrit. “There are no instances of its occurrence in the Vedic literature we have surveyed. The epics are similarly barren: neither
the Ramayana nor the Mahabharata give evidence of the epithet, although in one of the hymns
inserted in the latter Canda and Candi are applied to the deity they praised.”
And Sabari is a female name from Sabara tribe. Sabara tribe is associated with food-gathering and hunting activities. Tribal and indigenous people of India by Rabindra Nath Pati, Jagannatha Dash
In addition, at the page 235, Tribal roots of Hinduism by Shiv Kumar Tiwari, one can find the list of non-aryan tribes. The sanskrit refers Pulinda, Nishada, Sabara, Kiratas tribes repeatedly.
At next page, it gives account about Sabara tribes. Here’s a short except from the page.
“The earliest reference to the Sabara tribe is found in the Aitareya Brahmana wherein an account of its origin is given. It says that the eldest sons of Visvamitra were cursed to become the progency of the
most abject races such as Andhras, the Pundras, the Sabaras, the Pulindas and the Mutibas. These Dasyu tribes are said to have lived on the borders of the Aryan territory. The Mahabharat further elaborates this explanation. The Ramayana also confirms the tribe to be of non-Aryan origin.”
dilip said
This is for Barun Roy.
“Dear Dilip,Greetings from Darjeeling! Your source Baron Boutique is an online store and it suggests that “Jitadassi, the seventh King of the Kirats to have fought in the Mahabharata War.” In the very next sentence the writer writes, it was it was during his Gautama Buddha visited the Valley” I am not a historian but were the Pandavas contemporary to Gautama Buddha a vice versa.
I am sorry for the error. Here’s the more detailed and proven findings from the scholars.
The sixth Kirat King was Humati Hang when Arjun in Mahabharat visited Nepal where he learnt special fighting skill “Pashupatashra” from Kirat feudal chief. Kirat King Kuber gave him instructions and explained the meaning of civilized people (Devata) as Kirats were very proud themselves calling civilized people or devas.
Lord Budha visited central Nepal during the reign of 7th Kirat King Jitedashi. Under Jitedashi rule, Buddhism flourished though Kirats practiced Saivite Hinduism and Mundhum. Buddha preached in Nepal valley and was able to make 1350 disciples including Sariphutta, Ananda etc. King Ashoka ( India ) visited Nepal during the period of 269-265 BC when Kirat King Stungko was ruling the central Nepal. Ashoka constructed Budha stupa in Patan and Buddhist monument in Lumbini.
xxx said
I am sorry for the error. Here’s the more detailed and proven findings from the scholars.
————————————————————————
which ass historian has proven that mahabharata ever happened.
and who has proved that during the reign of Asok flourished a kingdom called Nepal.
do not make your own hitory. some bloggers on this blog come up with own history which are more of a fiction. what can we call it hitory fiction.
xxx said
and what is kirat, in the whole of indian history i have never come across the word kirat.
nor in the history of darjeeling or sikkim there is ever a mention of kirat.
dilip said
people like xxx who does not even have his name is born from dogs should not be associated with.
i don’t even want to say anything about this xxx who is so stupid and ignorant to come here and wants to spoiled the this topic. a person who does not know about Mahabharata claims he know know something. well share it with us child.
I Love My India said
The way Nepal govt misbehaved with Indian priest and Tibetian refuges, Indian govt give same treatment to Nepal citizens in India. Nepal is completly depends on India still they are very much anti Indian. These the Dharma of Parasites.
dilip said
This is for people like xxx!
xxx claim “and what is kirat, in the whole of indian history i have never come across the word kirat.
nor in the history of darjeeling or sikkim there is ever a mention of kirat. ”
The word Tibeto-Burmese or Mongoloid was the just the word given by the western scholars to describe people that look different from Aryan. This two word are relatively new.
But the word Kiratas denotes to all the Mongol people can be seen as described in the Veda~ Indians(aryan)oldest text!
In the ancient text such as veda, the mongoloid people were called KIRATAS.
Let me quote some paragraphs from the book (KIRATA-JANA-KRTI) by Suniti Kumar Chatterji.
The name Kirata is for the first time found in the Yajurveda (Sukla Yajurveda, Vajasaneya, XXX, 16;
also Krsna Yajurveda, Taittiriya Brahmana, III, 4,12,1).
In connexion with the Purusa-medha or ‘Man-Offering’ sacrifice, where a list of all kinds of human beings
and animals symbolically or figuratively offered to the gods as sacrifice is given, we find the following passage:–
guhabhyah Kiratam; sanubhyo Jambhakam;
paravatebhyah Kimpurusam
which upon translation will read ‘A Kirata, for the caves; a Jambhaka (long-toothed man?) for the slopes;
a Kimpurusa (an ugly man, a wild man, an ape?) for the mountains.’
Then in the Atharvaveda (X,4,14) we have a reference to a Kirata girl (Kairatika) who digs a herbal remedy on
the ridges of the mountains:–
Kairatika kumarika saka khanati bhesajam:
hiranyayibhir abhribhir girinam upa sanusu.
‘The young maid of Kirata race, a little damsel, digs the drug:
Digs it with shovels wrought of gold on the high ridges of the hills.’
(Translation by R.T.Griffith.)
“Macdonell and Keith have the following note in their Vedic Index on Kirata:
‘Kirata is a name applied to a people living in the caves of the mountains, as appears clearly from the dedication
of the Kirata to the caves in Vajasaneyi Samhita (also Taittiriya Brahmana), and from the reference to a Kirata
girl who digs a remedy on the ridges of the mountains.
KIRATAS are described in the ancient text as ‘gold-like’, i.e, yellow in color (and not dark or black like the Dasas
and Dasyus and the Nisadas and other pre-Aryan
people.
Here’s the quote from the the book taken from Kirata-parvan section of Varna-parvan of the Mahabharata.
Kairatam vesam asthaya kancana-druma-sannibham
“Taking up a Kirata resemblance, like unto a tree of gold” (IV,35,2);
dadarsatha tato jisnuh purusam kancana-prabham
“Then the Victorious One(Arjuna) saw a Man, shining like gold” (IV, 35,17);
na tvam asmin vana ghore bibhesi kanaka-prabha
“O thou that art shining like gold (addressing Siva in the form of Kirata), dost thou not fear in this terrible forest”
(IV, 35, 18)
As with all the Mongoliad people of Nepal,Darjeeeling, Sikkim their color(yellow) of their skin matches the one described in this ancient texts.
The Ramayana mentions the golden color of the Kiratas; thus
Kiratasca tiksna-cudasca hemabhah priya-darsanah,
antar-jala-cara ghora nara-vyaghra iti srutah
(Kiskindhya-Kanda, 40, 27, 28, qouted by N.N Vasu)
upon translation is The Kiratas, with hair done in pointed top-knots, pleasant to look upon, shining like gold, able
to move under water,
terrible, veritable tiger-men, so are they famed.
All the ancient works do NOT refer to Kiratas as only Rai and Limbu but all the Mongoloid people.
For example,the ancient texts never mention any ethnic groups such as Rai, Limbu, Sunuwar (who are recognized as Kirats by scholars long time ago) or
any other Mongoloid ethnic group even once but these same ancient works refers to all the people who were ‘gold-like’, as KIRATAS.
Secondly The Kiratas in Sanskrit (Sanskrit: किरात) mentioned in early Hindu texts are the tribal of the forest and mountains with this Sanskrit
phrase “kiram atati bhramati yah” meaning one wandering over the forests.
Now isn’t all the mongoloid people of Nepal, Darjeeling and Sikkim indigenous(adivasi).
The Vedas mentioned the indigenous as The Yavanas, the Kiratas, the Gandharvas, the Chinas, the Savaras, the Barbaras, the Sakas, the Tusharas, the Kankas, the Pathavas, the Andhras, the Madrakas, the Paundras, the Pulindas, the Ramathas, the Kamvojas who are all non-aryan in origin. They were all mentioned together as tribes beyond the kingdoms of Aryavarta. The Aryavarta-kings had doubts on dealing with them. (12,64).
In ancient Hindu scriptures, the Himalayan region extending from Himachal Pradesh, Uttarakhand, Uttar Pradesh, Bihar, Nepal Assam and Tripura was referred as the “Kirat Desh” or “the Land of Kirats”. Still today one can find mon khmer Kirat people in Himachal Pradesh.
Even the scholars have pointed out that all the Mongoloid people in Nepal are KIRATAS as qouted below.
“The ancient Kirantis of Nepal, a very powerful people in the neighborhood of the tribes on the northern frontier of the Himalayas are said to to have held dominion down to the delta of the Ganges. They were both short and tall in stracture having well-formed face, fair complexion, small, as well as large oval eyes, scantly beards, short nose, etc. Hodgson has placed the complex pronominalize language of Nepal under the head of Kiranti, which is connected with the Tibeto-Burman group. The most powerful section of the Kirantis who settled down in the Valley of Nepal in ancient times, probably in the pre-Christian era, are identified with the present days Kiratas, i.e Kulung, Thulung and Yellung. The Newaris who are happen to be one of the oldest inhabitants of Nepal Valley are also identified with the Kiratas. They are supposed to have lived between Gandaki and Sunkosi. In support of this identification, it has been noted Newari names of Patan Yellai is a changed form of Yellung Kiratas.
By no stretch of imagination, the Newaris, Gurungs, Magars and Lepchas can be identified with the Kiratas. The Thadus or Tharus occupying the Tarai region from Nepal and eastern Rohilkhanda along the frontiers of Oudh to Gorakhpur are supposed to be identical with the Kiratas. The great bulk of them are now subjects of Nepal Government.” by G.P Singh (The Kiratas in Ancient India), 1990
Hence since the dawn of the mankind, the mongoloid people were living in ancient India as tribes of the forest and mountains.
The two races(aryan and mongoloid) collided and the Aryan refer Mongoloid as KIRATAS as mentioned by the the
Vajasaneyi Samhita of the Shukla Yajurveda which refers Kiratas as cave dwellers. See above.
With the expansion of the Aryan civilization, the KIRATAS in ancient India slowly disintegrated but were never
defeated.
G.P Singh in his book “The Kiratas in Ancient India” 1990,
quoted this from the ancient work of India,
“those who are braves cannot be extinguish” referring to the Kiratas (Mongoloid people)
Therefore even after all these centuries of bringing people into the fold of Vedic Hinduism, and creating several ethnic division through caste system,
the Kiratas still exist today and some Kirati group has manage to keep the Kirat belief and culture intact though they have lost many original practices due to the Sanskritization.
Conclusion:
Together with ancient reference and scholars research, All Mongoloids are KIRATAS, thereby solving the issue of “Unity, not ethnic, division”.
You want more proof:
check this link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyar_(caste) , it describe all the Mongoloid as Kiratas and their distributions in ancient vedic time.
Kirats year is 5069 as 2009 which is older than the veda or the Indus civilization of Aryan.
Here’s the proof: http://www.tripura.org.in/origin.htm
Hope this help to people like xxx to clarify doubt about Kirat and who they were.
hom said
To my love india,
LOOK YOU NEED TO TREAT NEPLESE EQUALLY BECAUSE WITHOUT GURKHA THERE IS NO INDIA AND WE ARE YOUR SAVER AND YOU NEED TO OBEY US.
hom said
Dilip bro,
You are wasting your time with this xxx stupid guy what he knows about histry he is like asshole leave him alone and free yourself.
I Love My India said
FoR @47,In India every Indian has equal democraatic right, only some parasites dont want to pay taxes, attacks Adivasis, spread communal activites, disrespect dead bodies, pelted stone to tourists etc. They dont have place in India.
dilip said
Aryan came from Persia and entered the Indo-Gigantic plain(India). They brought with them this disease in a form of Vedic religion such as Varna(class)that created caste system and so on.
But in Nepal, there wasn’t any caste system and so on. The caste system only entered Nepal after the Mahabharata when the Brahmins from India started coming to Nepal.
The Vishnu Purana(Aryan scripture) indicate that the “chatur-varna” or four class social system was absent in the lands of Kiratas in the East and the Yavanas(Greek) and Kambojas(Iranian), etc. in the West.
where is land of Kirata?
In ancient Hindu scriptures such as veda and Mahabharata, the Himalayan region extending from Himachal Pradesh, Uttarakhand, Uttar Pradesh, Bihar, Nepal, Assam and Tripura was referred as the “Kirat Desh” or “the Land of Kirats”. Still today one can find mon khmer Kirat people in Himachal Pradesh. You can google it.
Hence today in the 21st century many discrimination because of caste system exist in India and Nepal thank you very much because of this vedic religion.
here’s some proof:
Two Dalits killed over temple worship
March 8th, 2009
CHENNAI – In separate incidents, two Dalits were killed following a dispute over worshipping in a temple in Tamil Nadu, the police said Saturday.
The victims were identified as K. Paramasivan, 27, and E. Easwaran, 55. The killings took place at Sankarankoil in Tirunelveli district.
Paramasivan was attacked Friday night when he was on his way to his village. Easwaran was attacked while riding a two-wheeler with a friend.
In both cases, the dispute apparently was over worshiping in a temple belonging to the largely pastoral Konar community.
In Nepal too many dalits who are referred to as untouchables are barred from going inside the Hindu Temple. Dalits are not allowed to drink from the same wells, attend the same temples, wear shoes in the presence of an upper caste, or drink from the same cups in tea stalls. These are just a few things they can’t do.
Lord Siva Mahadev Kirateswor never discriminate his own creations
but blesses any one who seek protection under him.
The Mahabharata text mentions that Lord Siva came as Kirata to test Arjuna. Later the same Lord Siva blessed Arjuna because Lord Siva was impressed by Arjuna. This shows that Lord Siva Kirateswor(Lord of Kirat people) who is non-aryan even helped
the outsider. This is one mere example of how Lord Siva Kirateswor
is bias less and never discriminate anyone.
But the greedy Aryan viz Brahmin viz Bahun for their own benefits change the myth.
They do not care what is right from wrong, even under the very eyes of Lord Siva himself.
Trust me if these dalits are rich these Brahmins will let dalit to his kitchen. Brahmin viz Bahun are money hungry they would lick a rupee out of Dalits ass.
Hence it is a good thing we kicked out these Indian brahmins from Nepal sacred temple.
Well correct me if i said is wrong.
I Love My India said
Well, in same manner kick out all the Parasites from India. Parasites means , those are not paying taxes, using illegal number plates, attacking Adivasis, pelted stone to tourists, getting three times more then earnining, spreading communal violance etc, disrespect dead bodies etc.
RAJA said
Dilip are you a dalit chap?? or you are a nepali brahmin who got the job of pujari in pashupatinath after kicking my fellow indian brahmin brothers?? As per you nepali brahmins are not money licking chap!! and they have dont believe in castism …. do you think we are insane and easily digest your all bakwas claims??
ram said
Hey raja,
I don’t like kiranti because they are our common enemy since histry.I am very sad weather nepal or india we are same bramhin why you insulting neplese bramhin.In real we see you like dalit not bramin we say madishe bahun that means lower then us for indians.
JTM said
Hey Ram
Why are you whining abt Bauns? Dont worry next janam maybe you will be reborn as a Swede or Mulatto, depending on yr karam and dharam.
JTM said
They brought with them this disease in a form of Vedic religion such as Varna(class)that created caste system and so on.
—————————————————————
How did this disease spread? There was no such thing as conversion by coercion, force or seduction.
The word ‘Caste’ system should be renamed as profession or ‘Karya’ system. and followed by the correct allocation.
All does practicising panditgiri will be called pandit karya,
soldiers as fauzi karya , sahukar karya, etc….and obviously it can only be applied according work not inheritance. A pandit karya’s son who becomes a IT professional will be called vishvakarma karya (according to the God of Industry).
What say Dilip?
Sanity said
#51.
I Love My India, are you a student of parasitology? Every post of yours includes the word parasite – parasite this, parasite that. But you seem to be stretching the definition of parasitism too far. Some of your examples are obvious commensalism or mutualism!
ram said
whatever you guys says but still we don’t listen because in veda says
BRAMHA DEVA THAT MEANS GOD Other are only born for slavery of bramhan.
JTM said
Hey Ram
Its a pity you have still not understood the Vedas. Pl change yr name. You are a disgrace to the name. Call yrself Ravan.
dilip said
ram what is Veda???
Veda is a scripture written by Aryan viz Brahmins viz Bahun.
Hinduism is a new term coined by some western scholar to classified all the religious practices in the Indian sub-continent.
In short, Hinduism=pre-vedic(Kirata+Dravidian)religion + veda(Aryan) religion. There’s not a single founder for Hinduism. Only now the scholars have come to see some lights that Hinduism was pretty much started by the aboriginals Kirata & Dravidian of ancient India. When the Aryans entered India they brought with them their own religion practices and God. Just to let you folks know that Siva and The fourteen gods that are popular in Hindu culture are the ancestral Kula Devta of Tripuri people and Not Aryan.
In other word Aryan has incorporated aborigines religions into their Veda. Many scholars have come to see this slowly now after studying the aborigines and their practices.
work reference: http://www.tripura.org.in/siva.htm
What is Aryan??
“Aryan” is derived from the Sanskrit and Avestan term arya-, the extended form aryana-, ari- and/or arya- of which the word Iran is a cognate. (Source: Wikipedia)
Precisely who the Aryans were and exactly where they came from is a puzzle still debated today. Historians have generally used the word “Aryan” to denote those peoples who spoke the Indo-European languages, which include English, German, Latin, Greek, Russian, Persian, and Sanskrit. “Aryan” also has a narrower racial meaning. It has quite often been used to designate mankind’s non-Semitic white-skinned race.
There are many theories about where Aryans first came from. A common hypothesis is that Aryans originated in the steppes (plains) of Russia. From there they may have migrated to Europe and down into Mesopotamia. Others believe that the Aryans arose in Europe and migrated eastward. Some theorists, occasionally for racist reasons, claim that Aryans were the founders of the ancient Mesopotamian civilizations and were therefore the world’s first civilized peoples. This theory was promoted during the brutal Nazi regime of Germany to bolster its “Aryan supremacy” idea. The Nazis even claimed that Aryans were originally created by Godlike superhumans from a different world. A similar belief was expressed earlier in history.
If the Aryans did indeed invade India (according to Max Muller’s invasion theory) then the evidence in the social system imposed on India by the Aryans were unmistakably designed to create human spiritual bondage. As elsewhere, this bondage was partially accomplished by giving spiritual truths a false twist. The result in India was a feudalistic institution known as the “caste” system.
Some of the scholars work;
The religion of most of the ancient communities of the Central Himalaya was primarily based on the superstitious beliefs
and was connected with the practice of sorcery, excorsim, and magic. The tree worship, the worship of Mother-Goddess
and Chandika Devi, snake worship, stone worship in the form of linga or the cult of phallus, held very important place among the
ethnic communities in ancient India. The aborigines of the mountain tribes of the country, who had not come into contacts with Brahmins revered an invisible supreme spirit, various other evil spirits, minor deities.., etc the practice which still survives.
Shiva, generally considered a non-aryan deity, secured a prominent place among the Kiratas.
It can be roughly asserted that Shiva-worship might have begun among the Kiratas in the mountainous regions of the Himalaya in pre-Vedic times, before the advent of aryans.
Shaivism, in some form, was the prevailing religion of the aboriginal Kiratas. On the basics of an episode described in the Mahabhrata, as well as in the Kiratarjuniyam, of Bharavi, the Kirata may be identified with Shiva, and it may be suggested that Shiva was their popular deity.
Romila Thapar, while supporting this literary evidence, also has admitted that in all likelihood the Kiratas were the worshipers of Shiva.
The assertion that Shiva, the god of the Himalayan mountain, was worshiped by the non-Vedic kiratas, can be proved
in many ways. Some of the foreign scholars have also consolidated the concept that Shiva was a patron godof the aboriginals. Megasthenes has also referred to the two Indian deities– Dionysus(identified with Shiva) and Herakles (identified with Krishna).
The former was worshiped as the highest gods on the mountains and the latter was adored in the plains.Thus it is clear that
the practice of worshiping Shiva might have begun much earlier to the Christian era, even though the Kiratas did not call themselves
Shaivas.
Chandrapida, the prince of Ujjian, in course of his expediation against the Kiratas and the kindred tribes, inhabiting the vast tract of forest extending beyond Suvarnapura, as far as the mountain Kailash(the abode of Shiva) in Tibet, saw both the Shiva temple and a cave in its southern direction, as recorded by Banabhatta in his Kadambari. That is a definite indication of Shiva worship in the Kirata region of the northern Himalaya. The concept of Shiva worship originally
flourished among primitive tribes, living in the hills and forests –the Vratyas, the Nisadas, and other non-aryan. By Dinesh Prasad Saklani (Ancient communities of the Himalaya)
“The combat between Lord Siva in the disguise of the Kirata with Arjuna in the Mahabhrata is an interesting example of association of Siva with primitive non-aryan tribe.
The archaeological discoveries also prove the existence of crude form of Saivism among the kiratas tribes of North-East frontier region(present Arunachal Pradesh) before the emrgence of mother cult. By the middle of the 7th century A.D, the Kiratas of this region were completely brought within the orbit of Hinduism.
Th Kiratas tribe of this region came under the influence of Brahmincal philosophy of Hinduism.
The Archaeologist Report of Dr. T. Bloch and the discovery of numerous objects in recent archaeological exploration clearly testify to the prevalence of Saivaism and the cult
of the Mother-Goddess in the north-eastern frontier region in ancient times.
The worship of Siva in the form of Phallus represents a remnant of the ante-Brahmanical religion of India. Linga worship became quite popular before the commencement of the Christian era. However, the Phallic worship among the Pre-Aryan tribes in the form of stones is in approximation to the truth, if it is not conclusive.
The clear conception of Siva arose in the Upanisadic age. Siva as been, for the first time, explicitly mentioned as the Aryan god in the Svetasvatara Upanisad in the background of Yoni-Linga relationship”. By Shiv Kumar Tiwari (Tribal roots of Hinduism)
SO WHY SHOULD THE ARYAN VIZ BRAHMIN VIZ BAHUN BE THE PREIST AT LORD SHIVA TEMPLE WHEN THE SCHOLARS HAVE FIND THE REASONS THAT SHIVA ORIGINALLY BELONGS TO ABORIGINES(KIRATA & DRAVIDIAN)PEOPLE?
ram said
Whatever you try to prove but bramhan are bramhan we use brain not phisical.who use phisical like you is sudra.
JTM said
You are proving that you are dumb
dilip said
Whatever i try to prove is from the scholars, Indian, Nepali and Western.
Who are you Ram and JTM???
Do you hold any degree in any specific major?
Well whatever i had said/ written is all from the scholars work.
You can find these scholars work in the market. Get it and read fools.
In these world of science, there’s no denying the TRUTH.
Maybe you want to hear from Your(aryan) veda scriptures too don’t you. Well i will give you once i have the time.
Just ASK yourself honestly? why do Aryans religions(Hinduism)have so many Gods/Goddess and deities??
Where did so many of these deities came from?
Do you really believe that Ramayana and Mahabharata was a war between God and Demon?
Go home and think about these first folks!
ram said
Who is ruling world now/
dilip said
The problem is not with Hinduism. The problems lies with the creator of the Veda teachings.
Hinduism is just a new term coined by the western scholar to classified all the religious practices in Indian sub-continent.
Veda did not said our religion is call Hinduism or give any name to it.
Therefore it is just known as Vedic teachings or Vedic Hinduism.
Hinduism= pre-vedic(Kirata+Dravidian) religion + vedic(Aryan) religion
Therefore folks learn to distinguish Hinduism first. Hinduism is not bad after all if you know enough facts. It just that bad element has come into it and influence it. Like Indians coming to Indian-subcontinent and influencing Nepal, Sikkim, Assam politics and so on.
The creations of Veda was for the benefits to some only. Many are treated as low born man who have to serve others. Anyone who was non-aryan or whose teachings differs from vedic religion was placed as low born man.
According to Srimad-Bhagavatam and Bhagavad-gita, anyone, including so-called low born men,
who may take shelter unto the Lotus Feet of Lord Krishna or His devotees, is sanctified by initiation process.
kirata-hunandhra-pulinda-pulkasa
abhira-sumbha yavanah khasadayah
ye ‘nye ca papa yad-apasrayasrayah
sudhyanti tasmai prabhavisnave namah
upon translation is;
Kirata, Huna, Andhra, Pulinda, Pulkasa, Abhira, Sumbha, Yavana, members of the Khasa races
and even others addicted to sinful acts can be purified by taking shelter of the devotees of the
Lord, due to His being the supreme power. I beg to offer my respectful obeisances unto Him.
(Srimad-Bhagavatam 2.4.18)
In the purport of this verse Srila Prabhupada describes the Pulindas as the Greeks, from whom Western civilization has descended, and the Hunas as the Europeans, who later inherited the Greek legacy. The Khasas are the Chinese, or Far-Eastern peoples. The Kiratas are described in the purport as aboriginal peoples from the Kirata province of “old Bharata-varsa.”
Now isn’t this a quite a contradiction? How can the Veda even classified other races as low born man whose teachings must have surely differs from vedic? Is like saying the Islam, the christians and other religions are of low born man.
When the Aryan found that their gods like Agni, Indra, Varun etc. were loosing popularity and people did not worshiped the gods which they brought, rather they were worshiping Subra(Siva)and following Saivisim, then they placed Sibarai worshiping under banned. At first the Aryanised conquerers held this religion (Saivism) in disdain and placed in under a ban. But it did not helped; ultimately peoples over come such banned and Saivism contininue to strive among the aborigines. At the same time to secure easy recognition by the aboriginal people, they placed Siva into Hindu pantheon. ~ By John Marshall, John Hubert Marshall Sir, Asian Educational Service
According to The Indo-Aryans of ancient South Asia By George Erdosy, the primitive Saivisim, Vaishnavism, Sankhya and Yoga which are the four corner stone of modern Hinduism was recognized as non-vedic by the orthodox exponent of the Vedism in the early periods.
“The clear conception of Siva arose in the Upanisadic age. Siva as been, for the first time, explicitly mentioned as the Aryan god in the Svetasvatara Upanisad in the background of Yoni-Linga relationship. There was never mention of Siva as Aryan god in Rig Veda, the oldest text of Aryan”. From here it can be ascertain that Siva was worshiped by the aboriginal Kirata and Dravidan people before the advent of Aryan. ~Tribal roots of Hinduism By Shiv Kumar Tiwari
Hence to secure easy recognition by the aboriginal people, the Veda placed Siva into its pantheon later when Aryan found that their gods like Agni, Indra, Varun etc. were loosing popularity and people did not worshiped the gods which they brought.
More conflicting is that since Siva is placed at the Hindu pantheon, why should these “low born man” whose religion was the worshiping nature,i.e stones, snakes reflecting Sivaism had to take shelter unto the Lotus Feet of Lord Krishna or His devotees?
The reasons are given by Romila Thapar in this excerpt.
“While supporting this literary evidence, also has admitted that in all likelihood the Kiratas were the worshippers of Shiva.The assertion that Shiva, the god of the Himalayan mountain, was worshiped by the non-Vedic kiratas, can be proved in many ways. Some of the foreign scholars have also consolidated the concept that Shiva was a patron god of the aborignals. Megasthenes has also referred to the two Indian deities– Dionysus(identified with Shiva) and
Herakles (identified with Krishna). The former was worshiped as the highest gods on the mountains and the latter was adored in the plains.Thus it is clear that the practice of worshiping Shiva might have begun much earlier to the Christian era, even though the Kiratas did not call themselves Shaivas.”
This shows that worshiping of Krishna was more evident in the plains than the hill regions and it can be seen Krishna as more to vedic teachings.
The Mahabharata epic tells how the Lord Krishna came to help Pandavas, while Lord Siva came as Kirata proves that Sivaism was one of the pre-vedic religion and belongs to aborigines living in the hills.
The following praise from the Veda scripts tells it all.
Om Namah Sivaya Kirataya
Om Namah Umayai Sabaryai
upon translation is;
“Om! Salutation to Siva, the all good, the Kirata!
“Om! Salutation to Uma, the mother, the Sabari!
And this is quite a high exaltation of the status for the non-Aryan hill people, when the scriptures from the vedic literature solely reveal the true identity of Siva and Uma.
Both Kirata and Sabari are aborigines of non-aryan origin. Sabari is a female name from Sabara tribe. Sabara tribe is associated with food-gathering and hunting activities. ~Tribal and indigenous people of India by Rabindra Nath Pati, Jagannatha Dash
It is therefore scholars have identified Siva and Sivaism with that of aborigines/tribes than of vedic teachings. With the advent of Aryan and influence of their Veda teachings, Siva and Sivaism was placed in the veda and as one of the trinity to secure easy recognition by the aboriginal people, they placed Siva into Hindu pantheon. ~ By John Marshall, John Hubert Marshall Sir, Asian Educational Service
Kiratas along with other tribes non-conforming to Vedic teachings was classified as Mleccha(babarians) in many early texts, in a sense that they were destroyers of Aryan. Hence the Siva was name as destroyer in the Hindu Trinity. ~ G.P Singh (The Kiratas in Ancient India, 1990)
As one scholar said “To begin with, the kipat system and the mundhum are traditionally uncontested metaphors of Kirata culture. Similarly the worshiping of Tagera Nyingmaphuma or the supreme deity was a pan-Kirata symbol. But with the abolition of kipat system and the simultaneous influence of Hinduism, these symbols
have lost their strength considerably. Since Tagera Nyingmaphuma, is often personified as Shiva, who is not only considered tribal God but also one of the Hindu pantheon, he cannot be claimed by the Kiratas as their exclusive God” —Politics of Culture:
A Study of Three Kirata Communities in the Eastern Himalayas), 1999 by Tanka Bahadur Subba
Hence we need to clearly distinguish between vedic and pre-vedic religion and to conform with the practices as have been doing for the time since immemorial.
There is no class(varna) in the pre-vedic religion. This is one merit which we can restore the glory days of pre-vedic periods.
So what is your Religion?
Now going through the historical facts mentioned above who are the original Hindu? Are the aborigines or those invaders Aryan? What are their gods they brought along with them and listed in the Vedas? What are the gods images found in the Indus valley?
Who have converted to Hindu to whom? Did the Aryan convert us to Hindu? Or the aboriginals(Kirata & Dravidian) converted Aryans to Hindu?
So my fellow Nepalese and aborigines of Indian-sub continent there is no cause to feel inferior or to feel that Hindu are not we or gods of Hindu are not ours. There is no reason to search for BETTE R GOD and BETTER RELIGION. No logic to through your OWN RELIGION & GOD. All the India’s religion, culture and land belong to the aboriginal people since 6000 years. The earth, water, fire, air, and sky of India are also yours, as it had been of your ancestors for thousands of years ago.
patleybaskounpad said
‘Now going through the historical facts mentioned above who are the original Hindu? Are the aborigines or those invaders Aryan? What are their gods they brought along with them and listed in the Vedas? What are the gods images found in the Indus valley?
Who have converted to Hindu to whom? Did the Aryan convert us to Hindu? Or the aboriginals(Kirata & Dravidian) converted Aryans to Hindu?’
so that means it is ok to ‘convert’ as someone or the other had been ‘converting’ someone or the other since times immemorial
dilip said
Varna(class)
The Hindu term for caste, a social division into which a person is born. There are four major castes in Hindu society: Brahmin, kshatriya, vaishya, and shudra. The first three castes are considered “twice-born.” Each Varna can be divided into a number of jatis. Below these four varnas are the untouchables.
Anyone who seriously studies the Hindu scriptures cannot disagree of the abuses heaped on Shudras. (Shudras include all Scheduled castes, the backward classes and the backward tribes in addition to the so-called Harijans.
Perhaps, keeping these in mind L.R. Bali has aptly titled his book on Hindu religion as “Hindu religion or Hindu slur?”
‘Don’t teach a Shudra’ – Skand Puran, Vaishnav Kand, Chapter 19.
Low caste people should not be imparted any knowledge. If a teacher tries to preach a Shudra, he would be a victim of many and evil. If a Brahmin teaches a Shudra, other Brahmins should boycott him. Such a Brahmin teacher must be shunned as if he was a ‘Chandal’ and also driven out of the village, educated Shudras should also be ousted. – Brahma Kand Chapter 10.
Punishment for learning to the Vedas
Another injunctions say that the Shudras should be strictly kept away from the Vedas. It is mentioned in the ‘Gautam Dharm Sutra’ that: “If a Shudra happens to hear the Vedic hymns, molten metal should be poured into his ears. If he chants the things he must be slashed with axes etc.
Punishment for seeking equality: Again according to Gautam Dharm Sutra, “If a Shudra ventures to sit on the same level or to sleep in the same bed or to walk on the seem road or to talk as the twice born (Brahmin, Kshatriya and Vaishya), he must be subjected to various punishments. – Gautam Dharam Sutra 2/3/5.
Monu has defined the nature of punishment to be given to the Shudra who dares to sit on the same seat as a Brahmin King. For such a crime a Shudra should be banished from the country after being branded with a red-hot iron or else his buttocks must be sliced away. – Manusmriti 8/281.
‘Manusmriti’ says a Shudra must be treated in such a way as a dacoit treats his victim. Allowing the forcible seizing of the possessions of a Shudra the smriti says: “If a sacrifice in not be completed owing to lack of resources a Vaishya may be approached for funds if he fails to rise to the occasion, necessary funds could be acquired from a rich Shudra by hook or by crook because a Shudra does not have anything to do in a sacrifice.” – Manusmriti 11/13.
Such injunctions are found in other parts of the Manusmriti also (Refer 18/4/7): “According to this verse of Brahmin could take away of Shudras property because a Shudra is not expected to possess any wealth. His master alone has the right to own his (Shudra’s) wealth.” – Manusmriti 8/417.
Slave by birth
The Hindu Dharam Shastras says Shudras are slaves by birth. ‘Manusmriti’ says that God has created Shudras to do menial work for Brahmins. Therefore, he must be treated like a slave. – Manusmriti 8/413.
Rate of interest
The Dharam Shastras give the sanction to realize the highest rate of interest from Shudras. (8/142 ibid.): “The Brahmins, the Kshatriyas, the Vaishya’s end the Shudras are entitled to pay the rate of interest 2, 3, 4 and 5 percent respectively.
Restrictions on marriage
‘Manusmriti’ declares that of Shudra cannot marry a girl from outside his caste. But a Brahmin can marry in the other three castes also in addition to his own. Similarly Kshatriyas and Vaishyas are allowed to marry girls from castes lower than their own castes. (Vide 13/131 Manusmriti).
Surnames off the Shudras
It is also mentioned in Dharam Shastras that the names of Shudras should reflect their state of bondman ship. In other words, the epithet ‘Das’ should be tagged to the names of Shudras. (Manusmriti 2/32).
Like ‘Manusmriti’, ‘Yamasmriti’ also enjoins that the word ‘Das’ must be attached to a Shudras name.
Similar injunctions are found in other Hindu Shastras also. Even books on grammar and poetry do not lag behind. Panini wrote in his ‘Astadhyayi’ that a respectable person need not use the protracted sound to a Shudra while reciprocating a salvation. But in the case of the other three castes he has to use it. (Panini 8/2/83).
According to ‘Natya Shastra,’ Shudras are to be seated near the blue pillar on the north-eastern side of the stage. (Sanskrit Drama P. 386). It also says the Shudra characters should appear dressed in blue color. (Ibid-P. 394-395).
The heroes of Sanskrit drama, must be of a noble descent. (Sahitya Darpan 3/30) and those of ‘Mahakavyas’ (epics) are to be Gods or Kshatriyas or people belonging to noble descent. – Sahitya Darpan 6/316.
Again there is a specification of languages spoken by the characters in the sanskrit drama. The nobility speaks Sanskrit, the lower caste characters Prakrit and the lowest castes, Paisahchi or Magadhi. (‘Dasarupakam’ 2/64-65.)
Untouchability
It is said in the Hindu Dharma Shastras that even the touch of a Shudra makes a high caste Hindu unholy. Therefore, one should shun even the shadow of a Shudra.
The ‘Samvart Smriti’ says that the touch of a sweeper, a fallen person, a corpse, a woman having excessive bleeding during her menstrual period, and a woman having had a recent childbirth, defiles a person. He should take bath if he is touched with these.
Not content with this illogical command, the law books go to the extent of saying that even the sight of the Shudra can pollute a high caste Hindu.
It is mentioned in the ‘Parashar smriti’ (6/24) that when one gets defiled by the site of a scavenger, the impurity can be removed by looking at the sun.
‘Vyas smriti (1/22/12) says Baniyas, Kiratas, Kayasthas, Malis, Chandal’s etc. are untouchables. Mere conversation with these people makes a twice born impure and the impurity can be removed by taking a bath. Similarly, impurity caused by the sight of them will be removed by looking at the sun.
The statements of the Dharma Shastras regarding sub-castes among Shudras are highly reprehensible. The following verses appear in the 10th chapter of the ‘Manusmriti’ bear testimony to the the global attitude shown towards the Chandal’s and the Svpachs (dog Meat eating Shudras): “The dwellings of the Chandal’s and the Svapachs must lie on the outskirts off the village. They can possess only dogs and donkeys as their wealth and they can wear only the clothes removed from the dead bodies. Their ornaments must be made of bronze and they can use only old and broken utensils to cook food. After doing his work, a Chandal must go back to his hut and he should not stand on the streets unnecessarily. He can marry within his caste only. Food should be served to these low castes in broken vessels and that also through servants. A Chandal cannot move in the town and village during night. He must bear Government’s seal on his person while attending to duty. A Chandal’s duties include disposal of unclaimed bodies and execution of the condemned criminals, according to the injunctions of the Shastras than the orders of the king. (verses 1051 – 1056)
Inferior to animals
Not only human beings but even God’s gets impure by the touch of the Shudra. A verse in the ‘Buddh Harith Smriti’ reads thus: “What should be done if a Shudra enters the outer courtyard of a temple or any other religious place? Making a cow walk on it and after that by smearing the floor with cow urine should purify such a place.
These statements to the show that even animals and a urine and given a better treatment their Shudras.
According to ‘Karika Vriti’, if a Chandal happens to defiles the courtyard of Shiv temple or Vishnu temple by his presence, the area measuring about Hundred meters surrounding the temple must be cleansed.
A Chandal could not take part in any village function. The ‘vriti’ that’s for the that calamities, like the decile in the powers of the presiding deity of the temple, death of the king and destruction of the village and standing crops etc., would occur if proper measures to purify are not begun in time.
“Thus the defilement of temple premises by the touch of a Shudra could prove disastrous to the king as well as to the country. However, the danger could be prevented by performing appropriate rites like sneering the place with cow dung etc.”
Here, once again, more importance is given to the excreta of animals then to the human beings.
A detailed description of the measures to be taken when the temple premises etc. become unholy by Shudras is given in the ‘Padmtantra’ Ch. 18: “First cleans the floor with a daub of cow dung and perform the rites to purify the place. After that give food to Brahmins. This must be followed by Vedic chanting and nonstop readings from the Purans. Cows must be shattered at proper places in the vicinity of the temple. This process must be continued for do or four months depending on the gravity of the scene. After this entity of the temple has been restored, the Brahmins, who chanted the hymns and read the Purans, should be appropriately rewarded. The temple’s must be renovated and new idols installed accompanied by proper ceremonies. After the installation, the idols must be washed with 1000 pots of water. And finally a grand festival should be arranged. It would prove harmful to both the king’s and the country in the cleansing was not properly performed.
Animal waste superior to Shudras
The Shastras also proclaimed that animals excreta is superior to Shudras because drinking of cows urine would purify the person defined by the touch of Shudra. (Samvart Smriti 183).
‘Samvart Smriti’ says if anyone belonging to the twice born category (Brahmin, Kshatriyas and Vaishya) happened take water by mistake from a holy place or from a river where Shudras what engaged in work, he should purify himself by taking ‘panchagavya’ –a preparation of cow dung, cow urine, milk curd and ghee.
According to ‘Prashar Smriti’ if a twice born drinks water by mistake from a well that by Shudra he should fast for 24 hours. Again if the drinks the water from the well which had become impure by the touch of utensil belonging to a sweeper, he has to drink cow urine and eat barley soaked in cow’s urine for period of three days. (Parasara Smriti Ch. 6).
The impurity caused by the touch of the Shudra is infectious if scriptures are the believed. For, even an indirect touch of the Shudra can defile a caste Hindu. In other words, a twice born can become impure if he is touched by those who have become polluted by coming in contact with the Shudra.
It is mentioned in the ‘Apastambh Smriti’ that a twice born after observing fast for one day and one night had to take ‘Panchgavya’ if he gets polluted by the contact of those who themselves were defiled by drinking water from the well made impure by a Shudra.
Shudra’s divided
The Hindu lawgivers have tried their best to sow the seed of rift among Shudras themselves. They took great care to keep Shudras divided so that the question of their coming together could not arise.
According to ‘Parashar Smriti,’ Chapter 6, if a twice born vomits the water which he drank from the vessel belonging to a scavenger, he can get over the sin by observing ‘Prajapaty’ vow. In case he fails to vomit and it gets absorbed in his body, he must observe the ‘Chandrayan’ vow.
Even these vows have been categorized: ‘Santapan’ for Brahmins, ‘Prajapaty’ for Kshatriyas and ‘Ardh Prajapatya’ for Vaishyas.
If a twice born or a Shudra happens to drink water on milk or God from the vessel of an outcast Chandal, the former can escape from the scene by observing ‘Brahm Varchas’ vow and the later by austerity and charity according to his capacity.
‘Atri Smriti’ also corroborates this practice of atonement of sin with the slight difference. It recommends ‘Chandrayan’ for Brahmins and ‘Santapan’ for Kshatriyas. Vaishyas have to drink ‘Panchgavya’, after observing simple fast for six nights and a Shudra can mitigate the sin by charity after three nights fast.
Right of inheritance
The Hindu law books say that Shudras can marry within their caste only, whereas the twice born are allowed to marry from lower Castes besides their own. That means all of the upper caste men could marry Shudra girls. But the children born of the Shudra woman to a twice born do not have equal rights of inheritance with those born of woman belonging to other three Castes.
According to Manusmriti (9/151), a son born of a Brahmin woman is entitled to inherit three parts of his father’s property, if born to a Kshatriya woman two parts, if born to a Vaishya woman 1.5 parts, while if born to a Shudra woman, 1 part only.
Ban on piety
Death is the reward for a Shudra who performs sacrifices and other religious rites.
Atri Smriti says the king must execute the Shudra who performs sacrifices etc. If he fails to do so, his country would be destroyed like fire by water.
An episode in the ‘Valmiki Ramayan’ says a Brahmin put the blame for the death of his young son on Lord Ram. Then Narad came and explained to Ram that the death was owing to the illegitimate ascetism of the Shudra.
In another context, it is said that Ram saw a boy in the direction of South doing penance. When Ram asked the boy reason for his penance, he replied that he wanted to conquer the ‘Devlok’ and then attain God-hood. He introduced himself as a Shudra named Sambuka. When Ram came to know the identity of the boy, he immediately killed him with his sword. And the gods expressed their gratitude by showering praises on Ram.
As simple as killing of frog
According to the Dharma Shastra, one can take the life of the Shudra in the same manner as one can do in the case of lesser animals like frogs, crows and owl’s.
Manusmriti says one can atone for the sin of killing animals like cats and dogs by observing the same vow as one does after killing the Shudra. – Manusmriti 11/131.
Disparity in legal matters
‘Manusmriti’ forbids a Shudra from giving evidence in the lawsuit involving Brahmins. Similarly, a Brahmin cannot give evidence in the Shudra’s case. Shudras alone can appear as witnesses in the case involving Shudras and the same applies to scavengers also. (‘Manusmriti’ 8/68).
If Kshatriya utters harsh words to a Brahmin, he has to pay a penalty of Hundred coins. In the case of Vaishya, it is raised to 200 coins. But a Shudra has to be given a death sentence for the same offense. On the contrary, the gravity of punishment is highly reduced when it is directed against a Brahmin. He has to pay 50 coins to a Kshatriya and 25 coins to the Vaishya and only 12 coins to a Shudra for committing a crime of impetuosity. (‘Manusmriti Ch. 8).
In short, the scriptures provide maximum punishment for Shudras while the other castes get lesser punishment for the same kind of offense.
The tongue of the Shudra who utters harsh words against the twice born must be cut, says Manusmriti. If they Shudra who announces the name and surname of the twice born or utters impertinent words like “Hey Yagnadatt you are a low Brahmin” etc., a 10 in. long red-hot iron nail is to be thrust into his mouth. – Manusmriti Ch. 8.
Ironically, a Shudra is punished even for doing good deeds. Religious preaching was considered to be righteous act, but Manusmriti says that hot oil must be poured into the mouth and ear of the Shudra who dares to preach a Brahmin.
When the Shudra or a Chandal assaults member of the upper Castes, the very limb with which he had hit must be cut.
Even the Adi Shankaracharya whom the modern Shankaracharyas represent, condemned the Shudras and recommended punishment if they happen to chant or hear Vedic hymns. (‘Brahma Sutra Bhasyam’ 1/3/34-38).
Craftsmanship
Instructions regarding the treatment to be given to the Shudras can be found in the Purans also.
‘Vayu’ and ‘Brahmanand’ Purans recommended craftsmanship and menial service as the only avocations for Shudras.
The Purans take great care to perpetuate the religious exploitation of Shudras.
‘Vishnu’ Puran says the Brahmin who performs a sacrifice for a Shudra would go to hell. (‘Vishnu Purana’ 2/6/18)
The same attitude is reflected in ‘Vishnu smriti’ and ‘Manusmriti’.
After going through all this, every Human Being would feel the need to Destroy the Hindu Society. So lets wake up and unite to change the attitude of all the fanatics for the benefit of the society. If we don’t do this, Hinduism will exist in the museum. We need to go back to pre-Vedic religions.
A religion where varna doesn not exist. A religion, our parampara which the aboriginal people in the Indian sub-continent have been practising since immorial time.
One thing about present Nepal government has done good is the kicking out Indian’s priest from the Pashupathinath temple recently.
I don’t mind dalits/shudras/kiratis to officiate the temple. If Pashupathinath temple is officiated by dalits and Kiratis, it recapture two essence here.
1. reviving the past of Kirateswor Pashupatinath.
2. the glory of the caste less Nepal again.
This ensures that Hinduism will continue to flourish in Nepal.
Jai Mahadev, Jai Nepal
dilip said
Hindu Deities, Sages and Saints Who were not Brahmins
“The origin of Sages, Truth and Rivers are unknown”—Mahabharata
This appendix lists some non-Brahmin or mixed caste great Deities, Saints and Sages of Hinduism. It will be apparent that these great men and women are responsible to a great extent for the development of Hinduism and that the title ‘Brahminism’ is rather a misnomer for our Dharma.
1. Sri Rama: He was a Kshatriya belonging to the Suryavamsa. His life is the theme of the popular Hindu epic Ramayana. He is considered the 7th incarnation of Lord Vishnu, who in turn represents the ‘Preserver’ aspect of God. He is considered an ideal son, an ideal king and so on. Hindu Utopia is often called ‘Ramarajya’, i.e., ‘the kingdom of Sri Rama’.
2. Sri Krishna: He to the belonged to the Yadava sub-caste. The Yadavas are currently enumerated amongst the ‘Other Backward Castes’ (OBC’s) in India. He is considered the most popular deity of Hindus, and revealed the ‘Bhagavad Gita’, which is the bedrock of modern Hinduism, and summarizes the philosophical teachings of all Hindu scriptures in a masterful manner. He is considered as the 8th incarnation of Lord Vishnu.
3. Lord Shiva: He is often termed as a ‘Kirata’ in the Puranas. The Kiratas would currently fall in the ‘Scheduled Tribes’ (ST) category in modern India. He is considered as a representation of the ‘Destroyer’ aspect of God and is one of the chief Hindu deities. He is the chief subject of numerous Hindu scriptures like the Shiva Purana, the Kurma Purana and so on.
4. Maharshi Aitreya Mahidasa: According to tradition, his mother was a maid named ‘Itara’. This Rishi is credited with the compilation of the Aitreya Brahmana and sections 1-3 of the Aitreya Aranyaka (the latter contains the Aitreya Upanishad- one of the 10 canonical Upanishads for Hindus) belonging to the Rigveda.
5. Rishika Lopamudra: She was a Kshatriya princess from Vidarbha, who married Maharshi Agastya. She is the Seer of some verses of the Rigveda. Several edifying dialogs between her and Sage Agastya are recorded in the Puranas.
6. Maharshi Vishwamitra: He was originally a Kshatriya named ‘Vishwaratha’. He is credited with revealing the ‘Gayatri Mantra’, the Hindu prayer par-excellence. He was elevated to Brahminhood because of his spiritual luster.
7. Maharshi Veda Vyasa: He was the son of a fisher-woman named Satyavati, from Rishi Parashara. Considered the greatest Rishi of classical Hinduism, he is believed to have give the 4 Vedas ( = the most authoritative scriptures of Hindus) their present form. He also compiled the Mahabharata and the Puranas, which are the mainstay of popular Hinduism. He also authored the Brahmasutras- a text considered as one of the triple canon of Vedantic Hinduism (the other two being the Gita and the Upanishads). His birthday is celebrated as ‘Guru-Poornima’ by Hindu monks every year. All Hindu monastic orders trace their lineage from him and a popular saying goes: “vyasocchishtam jagatsarvam” meaning that so great was the learning Rishi Veda Vyasa, that even his voluminous writings represent only the periphery of his knowledge.
8. Maharshi Matanga: He was the son of a Shudra mother and a Vaishya father. In fact, Chandalas are often addressed as ‘Matanga ’in passages like Varaha Purana 1.139.91
9. Maharshi Valmiki: He was descendant from Sages but had become a chandaala (= an outcaste) named Ratnakara, because he took to murder and highway robbery. He was reformed by Prajapati Brahma and was inspired by the divine Sage Narada to compose the Hindu epic par excellence- the Ramayana.
10. Rishika Sulabhaa Maitreyi: She was a Kshatriya lady who promulgated the Saulabha Shakha of the Rigveda. She is counted among the revered teachers of Rigveda to whom respects are offered in texts like the Kausitaki Brahmana. The Saulabha Brahmana is now lost but is mentioned in the Kashika- a commentary on the grammatical text named Ashtadhyayi. A dialog of Rishika SulabhA with King Janaka of Videha on spirituality is recorded in the Shanti Parvan (12th book) of the Mahabharata.
11. Mahatma Vidura: He was the son of Maharshi Veda Vyasa and a maid of King Dhritrashtra (the father of Kauravas in the Mahabharata). He is a wise man in the Mahabharata and counseled many towards truth. His teachings are collected in the ‘Viduraprajagar’ section of the Udyog Parvan (5th book) of Mahabharata.
12. Gautama Buddha: The founder of Buddhism belonged to a marginal Kshatriya tribe called Shakya. He lived and died as a Hindu, although his followers founded a new religion in his name. He advocated the supremacy of good ethics and morality over philosophical speculation and ritualism. He is considered the 9th incarnation of Lord Vishnu by devout Hindus.
13. Mahavira: The 24th and the last great Teacher of Jainism. He belonged to the Kshatriya Licchivi tribe of Bihar. He advocated vegetarianism and the centrality of compassion in Dharma.
14. Bhakta Nammalvar: The foremost of the Alvar Vaishnava saints, he was a Shudra by birth. His composition ‘Tiruvayamoli’, which is in the Tamil language, is considered at par with the Vedas by the Sri Vaishnava Hindus.
15. Sikh Gurus: All the Sikh Gurus, from Guru Nanak to Guru Gobind Singh, were Kshatriyas. The teachings of the first 5 and the 9th Guru are compiled in the Adi Granth- the Sikh scripture. In the face of Islamic persecutions, they revitalized the Hindu community of what is now Pakistan and parts of Northern India and preached the simple path of performance of good deeds, devotion to God by recitations of His names and singing of His glory and sharing of one another’s joys and sorrows without regard to caste.
16. Saint Kabir: He was brought-up by ‘Julaha’ couple. Julahas are a Muslim caste of weavers. He preached in the language of the masses and many of his verses are common proverbs in North India.
17. Narsi Mehta: He was born in a Vaishya family is a renowned Vaishnava saint of Gujarat. One of his compositions- “Vaishnava Jana” was a favorite of Mahatma Gandhi. According to some however, he was a Brahmin.
18. Saint Tukarama: He was a Vaishya who composed touching poems called the ‘Abahngas’ on devotion to God. These compositions are recited with great fervor by numerous Hindus, especially in Maharashtra by the members of the Warakari community.
19. Saint Ravidas: He was a cobbler, and therefore of Shudra origin. He advocated Bhakti and 16 of his compositions were incorporated in the Adi Granth- the Sikh scripture.
20. Saint Mira: She was a Rajput Kshatriya princess of Mewar and devoted her life to the service of Lord Krishna. Her beautiful poetical compositions addressed to Lord Krishna are recited with great fervor by Hindus down to this day.
21. Swami Vivekananda: One of the foremost reformers and teachers of modern Hinduism, he was of Kayastha subcaste of Bengal. He spread the message of Vedanta in the United States and Europe and his writings and speeches are contained in “The Collected Writings of Swami Vivekanand.” He founded the Ramakrishna Mission- a religious organization to propagate the teachings of his Guru Swami Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. In Bengal, Kayasthas are considered as Shudras.
22. Vatsa, a descendant of Kanva RV 6.1; 8.8 etc; was called a Shudra-putra (Panchavimsha Brahman 14.66).
23. Kakshivat, a Brahmavadin, was the son of Dirghatamas by a Shudra maid servant (Brihaddevata 4.24-25).
24. According to Mahabharata (Anushasana Parvan 53.13-19), Sage Kapinjalada was a Chandala and Sage Madanapala was the son of a boatwoman.
25. According to Mahabharata Shanti Parvan, King Sudas was also a Shudra. Sudas is one of the most celebrated kings of the Rigveda, being the hero of the Dasarajna war.
Bibliography and References
1. S. Radhakrishnan; The Upanisads; Indus (Publishers); New Delhi; 1995
2. Jagdish Lal Shastri; Upanishatsagrahah; Motilal Banarsidass; Delhi; 1970 [This book gives the text of the Upanishad in Devanagari script]
Links
1. Global Hindu Electronic Network [ http://www.hindunet.org ]
http://dir.yahoo.com/Society_and_Culture/Religion_and_Spirituality/Faiths_and_Practices/Hinduism/
3. The Caste System http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/9089/hr/caste.html
4. The Himalayan Academy http://www.HimalayanAcademy.com At this website, a search by ‘Caste’ will give several articles of interest.
dilip said
Hence i’m wondering why there is so much discrimination of Shudras and Dalits and to those who do not conform with Vedic teachings when some of the Hindu Deities, Sages and Saints were NOT Brahmins. The only problem one can see is that if you study Hinduism closely, it lies with the Vedic teachings which have almost incorporated all other aborigines religions into their Veda. Hinduism really is belongs to the aborigines and the low caste group.
Therefore folks, learn to distinguish the True Hinduism. Learn to distinguish Pre-Vedic religions from Veda religions.
Once we eradicate the bad elements that have come from Veda, Hinduism will continue to strive. It is today because of the Veda teachings that Hinduism is in danger. Christians missionaries are in Nepal and India concerting dalits and shudras and all the low born man into Christian.
If we act late, then Hinduism will only exist in the museum.
So re-educate folks about Hinduism.
ॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐ
Om Namah Siva Paruhang Mahadev Kirateswor!
Om Namah Siva Paruhang Mahadev Kirateswor!
Om Namah Siva Paruhang Mahadev Kirateswor!
ॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐॐ
ॐOM Shanti ॐOM Shanti ॐOM Shanti
ram said
I PROMISE IT IS NEVER SAID ABOVE WORD DILIP.
dilip said
Ram who you trying to kid man??
Everything i said came from manuscripts and the scholars.
All these have been recorded down Ram.
JTM said
Daer Dilip Keep going. I find yr posts very interesting.
Now the fantabolous four from Tibet(Amfoi, Phurba, Theba, Dobrub) will follow me on this post.
theba said
Maam,
“Bhote” would be the better term……
Unfortunately, any one with with chinky eyes and all matwaalis ( including magar thapas, puns, purjas, ales) and ofcourse rais, tamangs, gurungs, limbus, tamangs are all referred as “Bhotes” in the great bastion of your Gorkha Lineage Nepal…..
Maam,
It seems Gorkhas to you means all pomp, pageant, ribbons, colours, drums, whistle…but for us in Darjeeling simply put it is an evolved identity of all Nepali Speakers in India including Marwaris, Tibetans, Bhotes, Newars, Magars, Rais, Bengalees, Limbus, Gurungs, Bahuns, Chettris, Kamis, Bhojpuris, Maithilees,Hyolmos, Sherpas, Jirels, Bhujels etc etc etc
Why Gorkha…because of 1950 treaty between India and Nepal we want an distinct identity that of “Gorkha’and do not want to be confused with Nepalis as we are demanding a separate state within Indian Union called Gorkha land…
Under this circumstances, to relate Gorkhas just with Gorkha Army and it’s associated culture I feel is too restricted a view.
BTW I am a Murmi…and the some post above has mentioned Shiva being a Kiraat…so from now on all in my in laws would be…Shiva’s offspring. He He.
That’s all…
Lahure said
I ve a haunch that some, some r too busy preparing for next round.
Dillip bro…we expect more …go on
JTM said
I do not want to reply to Theba here because let us keep Dilip’s efforts unaffected.
Sanity said
Dilip bro, before you bring in your “next round”, can you remind us again what is the point you are trying to make? Shiva was a Kirata god is one thing I got hold of but what is that with all the Vedas and Manusmritis?
Pankaj said
HIndus are so soft and foolish,they will even raise their voice and protest against exploitation of muslims or any other religion. No wonder they are going to be extinct soon in this “survival of the fittest” world.
JTM said
SAYS THEBA ‘It seems Gorkhas to you means all pomp, pageant, ribbons, colours, drums, whistle…but for us in Darjeeling simply put it is an evolved identity of all Nepali Speakers in India including Marwaris, Tibetans, Bhotes, Newars, Magars, Rais, Bengalees, Limbus, Gurungs, Bahuns, Chettris, Kamis, Bhojpuris, Maithilees,Hyolmos, Sherpas, Jirels, Bhujels etc etc etc’
————————————————————
All those against Gorkhaland are making a huge mistake by abusing Nepalis or Gorkhas. As per Darjeelinger Theba and his friends, the target includes all communities mentioned above starting with marwaris, followed by Tibetans,etc. So kindly do not take out your venom against Nepalis, Nepalese or Gorkhas.
patleybaskounpad said
#76
what are you trying to say?
JTM said
He is trying to say that Hinduism has been a very a tolerant religion. While very few non-Hindus protest against anything happening to any Hindu , people of Hindu religion join voices against atrocities committed on other religious groups by anybody. Which is true. Keeping aside a few fundamentalists, most of us identify ourselves as a nation or society member first.
Most of the debacles have been created by incompetent politicians. If the Indian PM Narasimha rao had allowed a Ram temple to be built alongwith the Babri masjid, the Babri masjid episode would not have happened leading to cost of lives and the rise of Hindutava by some. There was no Hindutva before the babri masjid episode. There was a RSS which most Hinuds themselves did not agree with or subscribe to.
ram said
Dilip is stupid man he doesn’t know bramhin are ruling world and you see we ruling nepal now.There is guarantee we always make you sudra and we are superior.Kirant they are sudra.
JTM said
Dilp expresses his points with lot of reference material.
You Mr Ram, kindly elaborate on yr point with logical authentic references please.
Anyone who uses expletives like stupid, idiot is a losing debator.
theba said
JTM,
You may have noticed that my definition of Gorkhas for the sake of Gorkhaland also includes Marwaris, Bangalees, Koche, Meches, Bhotes, Lapches as well in the same bracket as Rai, Magars, Tamangs, Newars etc etc.
The reason being, in Darjeeling the primary lingo is Nepali/Gorkha when we speak to each other… just like an Awadhi when speaking to a Bhojpuri in UP is Hindi or an Maithili speaking to any one in Patna is also Hindi.
Guptaji ( of Bihaari Origin and living in Ghum Pahad of Darjeeling) for ages speaks in Nepali/Gorkha when addressing Bhola Roy ( neighbourhood Carpenter and a bangali originally somewhere from Bangal ).
Similarly, Tenzin with Tibetan Lineage speaks in Nepali/Gorkha with Mr Banwari Mittal while shopping for weekly grocery in Haat Bazaar in Kalimpong.
For us this is the evolved identity of a Gorkha/ Nepali ( for the sake of better term)
JTM said
my definition of Gorkhas for the sake of Gorkhaland also includes Marwaris, Bangalees, Koche, Meches, Bhotes, Lapches as well in the same bracket as Rai, Magars, Tamangs, Newars etc etc.
—————————————————————–
Point taken.
Fine you’ll have all become Gorkhas for unity of the purpose. That is good. We also became Gorkhas at an earlier period for a unity of purpose.That is alright.
But you are forgetting one major thing. Then you are the not the only Gorkhas in India. The evolution started from the Northwest side longtime. And yes though most of us might not be serving in the army, We have full respect for the forces which initially nurtured our presence and regard here.
So to be of the Indian Gorkha fraternity you cannot just discard all this and base it only on yr own environment. I find contempt towards our Gorkhali society values from yr side. Then how can we be the same Indian Gorkhalis?
In that case, The India govt will have to very carefully differentiate the two Gorkha communities in India. The Northwest and the North east. If we cannot assimilate, then either you will lose or we will or you will win and we will lose. And mind you this is not demand happening in Nepal, but in India.
My support for Gorkhaland in Darjeeling district however continues.
JTM said
Actually NW Gorkhas winning or losing does not matter cos we are not demanding for any state.
JTM said
In fcat you’ll mist get Gorkhalnd because we are sacttered in small numbers evrywhere and will not be sustain the Gorkha identity for too long in the future. But kindly do not question or berate the Gorkha regts because we owe what we are to them from the British times til date. Without meaning any offence, not one of our girls have ever come to seek jobs in the city as maids or whatver. Because the army has given each Gorkha family in our region the means to at least live at some decent economic level. LOts of our girls from socalled lower income levels have joined the Home guards in the state or are studying nursing and joining as govt nurses or as clerks in govt offices. Hope such options open soon for the girl from yr side.
JTM said
Sorry, In fact you’ll must get Gorkhalnd because we are scattered in small numbers everywhere and will not be able to sustain the Gorkha identity for too long in the future. The Chettris and Bauns are returning to their folds amongst similar castes amongst non-gorkhalis through marriages and other social alliances.
patleybaskounpad said
#85..
employment demographics of Gorkha (nepali) women in the Darjeeling hills while not being anything to write home about are however ’superior’ than what you have just posted about Nepali women elsewhere…
here at least it is more diverse…many of them are teachers, civil servants, doctors and nurses , clerks , policewomen…some even entrepreneurs..etc..
and the much maligned quota system have befitted the SC and ST Gorkha (nepali) women ..may of them having reached the upper echelons of district and even state administration…
of course as compared to others we are still a long way off..but then as i never fail to mention or feel proud of…our women are strong, they form the backbone of our society, our sex ratio is not as skewed as that of say Haryana..and the girl child is sent to school-now with the GJMM nari morcha they are even politically vocal( earlier too, the MLA from kalimpong was a woman, the incumbent MLA of Kurseong is a Nepali woman…the earlier speaker of Sikkim , legislative assembly was also a woman, the sahitya academy winner a few times have been Nepali women like lucki devi sundas and bindhya subba..in fact their have been quite a few achievers…one of them if i remember even topped the IFS from the open category etc…)
hope you do not infer that ’superior’ tag negatively…
JTM said
You are again giving yr ‘Baathey’ ones. Forget it! we cannot even converse without you taking off in a wrong tangent. I am not interested in yr demographics neither have I asked for it. With yr attitude you will not be able to get along with anyone forget evn a Gorkhali from outside Darj. The world sees a Darj district girl in almost household here. Nobody sees NE girls from Manipur or Mizoram or nagaland working as maids. Yes one sees many of these girls working in Delhi as shopping assistants in malls or as nurses in hospitals. Get real!
Forget haryana! I am sure there are lucky girls who are working in top notch posns in yr society, but here we are worried of those so deprived that they have to come here in droves to work as maids and face the traumas of the evils of society.
layman said
i never fail to mention or feel proud of…our women are strong, they form the backbone of our society, our sex ratio is not as skewed as that of say Haryana..and the girl child is sent to school-now with the GJMM nari morcha they are even politically vocal( earlier too, the MLA from kalimpong was a woman, the incumbent MLA of Kurseong is a Nepali woman…the earlier speaker of Sikkim , legislative assembly was also a woman, the sahitya academy winner a few times have been Nepali women like lucki devi sundas and bindhya subba..in fact their have been quite a few achievers…one of them if i remember even topped the IFS from the open category etc…)
hope you do not infer that ’superior’ tag negatively…
……………………………………………………………………..
Absolutely true!
The position of women in our society is very possibly best in entire India. We have no DOWRY, rape cases are rare, they are treated with high esteem. Its OK to choose their husband and parents dont desperately ‘find’ one for them. They can dress as they please, move where they want. I feel proud that women are treated equally.
I am proud of them !!!!
patleybaskounpad said
“the world sees a Darj district girl in almost household here. Get real!”
the world, like truth, i guess is what JTM experiences or believes..and you are asking me to get real? that’s not very fair isn’t it…
JTM said
Well then have it yr way. I have no problems. See the world as Patley sees it, which is difficult as one does not evn know you are behind yr camouflage.
patleybaskounpad said
#91
nowhere in my posts do i suggest or prescribe a world view.. neither do i get agitated when positions contrary to those i have taken are assumed by others….i just agree or disagree on the merit of issues and don’t allow myself to respond to factors that are beyond what i read or ascribe to words made in this blog….
dilip said
This text tells the origin of Chandika(Durga).
“Swami Prajnananda says Savarotsava is Durga Puja. Swami Abhedananda remarks that Durga was worshiped by Savar, Barbar, Pulinda caste. She was addicted to meat and wine, etc. The Chandipuza of autumn season was therefore called Savarotsava………….Durga and Chandi were the goddess of the Kirata caste. So Durga other name is Kiratini”. ~ Kamakhya Temple By Kali Prasad Goswami
This is one example where Kirat religion has been incorporated into Vedic Religion.
According to Coburn, it is striking that the word Candika has virtually no earlier history in Sanskrit. “There are no instances of its occurrence in the Vedic literature we have surveyed. The epics are similarly barren: neither the Ramayana nor the Mahabharata give evidence of the epithet, although in one of the hymns inserted in the latter Canda and Candi are applied to the deity they praised”.~ Devi Mahatmya by Coburn, Thomas B.
This tells us that like Siva, Chandika has never been mentioned as
Vedic God in the Rig-Veda, the oldest of Aryan text.
Siva, Chandika and God knows how many other tribal/native religions are incorporated into Vedic Religion after the conquest of Aryan.
While the same Rig-Veda, only mentioned of Agni, Varuna,Indra and Soma as the Vedic(Aryan) lord.
So wake up folks!
The Sanskrit dictionary, (Monier-Williams) explains Matamgi as names of the mythical mother of elephant tribe; a Candala or Kirata woman; name of a form of Durga, and further as one of the ten mahavidyas and as the mother of Vasistha. Matamga means elephant, Candala (man of the lowest rank) or Kirata(mountainer, babarian), and the name of the serpent demon.
~ Nityasumagali By Saskia C. Kersenboom-Story, Saskia Kersenboom
Kirant people in Nepal celebrate Sakela(Chandi) festival every May and October. The celebration of Sakela is connected to many myths. One of them being dedicated to mother Goddess Kiratini who is better known by Chandika and Durga.
ram said
Who write all this we bramhin do you write your reference it’s we who wrote for you say bramn dev for us.any chetri bramhin or indian there we would not support gorkhaland because our lbramhin from india ruling them don’t come to allince with this mongol.
theba said
Absolutely true!
The position of women in our society is very possibly best in entire India. We have no DOWRY, rape cases are rare, they are treated with high esteem. Its OK to choose their husband and parents dont desperately ‘find’ one for them. They can dress as they please, move where they want. I feel proud that women are treated equally.
I am proud of them !!!!
—————————————————————–
Layman, Yes Socially…The Status of Females in Darjeeling is far more progressive much better than the gender status of Females in Mainstream Bengal and other parts of India.
However, there is huge crack I feel in many strata of the society especially from a socio-economic indicator point of view.
JTM said
@94
Ibrahim (of Islam)or Abraham (of Christianity) was a brahmin? News to me.
ram said
yes you are first man was bramhin.
ram said
Bramhin are god and other are all slaves.
ram said
Speciall dilip is sudra.
dilip said
In early period, Aryan worst hated, dreaded and feared enemy was Kiratas. As i have already mentioned that Kiratas are not only
Rai, Limbu, Sunuwar, Yakkha in which scholars have recognized long time ago.
Kiratas refers to all the Mongol people who are label Mongoloid or Tibeto-Burmese by the scholars. But the word Kiratas existed since
Assyria and Babylon period. The Aryan has always refers to Mongol people as Kiratas in their veda, purano and epics.
The scholars have identified that the Kirat people migrated from Assyria, an ancient Mesopotamia region and the Kirat-Mongol roots are at Babylon, south of Mesopotamia. The scholars mentioned that the Kirat-Mongol people migrated to east, the Indian sub-continent before the Aryan.
But the Aryan and the Kirat-Mongol people have known each other in Persia. The Chinese too originated from the Assyria as the Kiratas.
The Kiratas entered the Indian sub-continent and the Himalayas region way before the Aryans. Those that entered north of Himalayas region became known as Cinas(Chinese). From China, the Mongoloid people migrated to Mongolia, Korea and Japan.
From the Indian sub-continent, the Kirat-Mongol people migrated to Assam, Sikkim, Burma, Thailand, and other south-east Asia regions.
In the same way, the Mongol people from Mongolia and China migrated down to the Himalayas region of Assam, Sikkim and Nepalin later periods.
These group of people became known as Gurungs, Magars, Tamangs, Thakalis, Sherpas and other Tibeto-Burmese group in Nepal, Assam and Sikkim.
These group intermingled with the Khambos(Rais and Limbus) who entered the Indian sub-continent first to form a bigger human race. This is all mentioned in “The History of the Kirat People” which was only published in 2003 after intensive research by scholars of archaeologist, anthropologist and historians.
This work can also be found online:
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2199990/
HISTORY-OF-THE-KIRAT-PEOPLE
When the Aryan(Indian) came to India for the first time, they had to fight the aboriginal people Kiratas led by the Kirat-Ashur King
Shambara. The Rig-Veda stated that Demon Shambara fought Vasu-Deo for 40 years.
The scholars have now seen the reason that Shambara was most feared and hated by Aryan and label him as demon King in the veda text because
Shambara led the Kiratas against Aryan invasion of their land and for survival. The same text mentioned Kiratas as rakshas(Demons), mleccha(“non-Vedic, Barbarian”) and all there is with demeaning names.
source:
Rig-Veda
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2199990/
HISTORY-OF-THE-KIRAT-PEOPLE
After 40 years of war, the Kiratas were defeated. They migrated towards the Himalayas region from the plains of India.
Later the Kiratas assemebled again and their Kingdom was called “Kiratdesh” or land of Kirat stretching from Himalchal Pradesh in the west to Assam in the East and Chittagong(Bangladesh)in the South. Still today you can find Mon Khmer people of Kirat race
in Himalchal Pradesh. Just Google it. The other regions where Kiratas are living are in Nepal, Assam, Darejeeling and Sikkim.
Agian during the Mahabharata war, the Kiratas fought the Aryan(Indian) against the Indo-Aryan invasion of their land.
In this war, Cina(chinese) fought alongside Kiratas against Aryan Kings. This is all recorded down in Mahabharata text.
In the Mahabharata, the Kiratas are mostly associated with foreign peoples, like the Yavanas(Greeks), the Sakas(Persian, and the Pallavas(Dravidian), who belong
to the west; but especially with the Cinas or the Chinese.
Bhagadatta, the King of Pragyotisadhipah(Assam) who took part in the Kurukshetra battle; was definitely described as a ruler over Mlecchas, which time again and again Kiratas was label as barbarians by the Aryans in their texts.
Here’s a short excerpt from the Mahabharata text:
“Pragjyotisadhipah suro mlecchanan adhipo bali”
upon translation is
“the powerful hero, the lord of Pragjyotisa,the lord of Mlecchas”
And in the Sapha-parvan (26, 9, quoted) in the Raja-mala, I, p. 84) we find—
sa Kirataisca Cinaisca vrtah Pragjyotiso bhavat,
anyaisca bahubhir yodhaih sagaranupa-vasibhih
upon translation is
“The Pragjyotisa (King) was there, surrounded by Kiratas and Cinas (Chinese) and with many other warriors dwelling by the coast of the sea.
In Stri-parvan, 23, Bhagadatta is described as having his seat among hills with this qoute
“esa sailalayo raja Bhagadattah pratapavan”
upon trans.
“here is the mighty King Bhagadattah whose home is in the hills”.
In the epic of the Mahabharata, the Cinas(Chinese) appear together with the Kiratas among the armies of king Bhagadatta of Pragjyotisa (Assam) taking side of Kauravas.
Mahabharata, V.584, ASB. edition, II, 1836) quote:
“Bhagadatto mahipalah senam aksauhinim dadau: tasya Cinaih Kirataisca kancanair iva samvrtam, babhau balam anadhrsyam karnikara-vanam yatha”.
upon translation is
“The Cinas and Kiratas soldiers appeared to be in gold: their troops had the appearance of a forest of Karnikaras(with yellow flowers)”
source:
Rig-Veda, Mahabharata,
KIRATA-JANA-KRTI by Suniti Kumar Chatterji
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2199990/
HISTORY-OF-THE-KIRAT-PEOPLE
From here it can be seen that the first Mongol King in the Indian sub-continent was Shambara.
Secondly it can surely be that the Kiratas who practiced Sivaism influenced the Cinas(chinese) and so the worshiping of Siva made
it to China. From China it went as far as Japan.
There’s no record of Brahmins going to China or Japan to teach about Siva as early as the 20th century.
So folks, tell me whose religion is Sivaism belongs to then?
How come the Brahmin’s still can claim Siva as Vedic religion when so much has been found by the scholars already.
It’s like Lord Buddha who was born of Sakya family(Newar ethnicity) which again is Mongoloid race later was incorporated as the 9th incarnation of Lord Bishnu
of Vedic teachings. Now what a pile of garbage. First the Lord Buddha teaching was different from the Vedic religion.
In Buddhism there is no caste system and discrimination like Vedic teachings said that Sudras and all low-born men are not suppose to receive education
especially of Veda and Sanskrit. If any sudras do hear the sacred hyms of Veda, he should be punished as described above given by me earlier.
Even the teacher(guru) will be shun away from the Brahmins community if he dare to impart Veda knowledge to others beside Brahmins and Chettris.
It also said that if Kiratas or low born men learn the sacred knowledge from Veda, he would lose his mind. What a pile of shit!!!!!
So now suddenly Lord Buddha finds himself as the 9th incarnation of Bishnu and into Vedic Hinduism. Why if you ask?
The reason is because the Brahmins saw this as a danger to their Vedic religion. They knew that Buddha have a different philosophy and ideology, almost opposite
to Vedic religion. In Buddhism every living creatures are treated and respected equally. Hence the Brahmins knew if they let Buddhism flourish as a single different religion
away from Vedic Hinduism, then they knew that people will start converting to Buddhism. So the clever, opportunistic Brahmin’s cunningly and cleverly incorporated Lord
Buddha into the Vedic religion giving Buddha as the 9th incarnation title of Bishnu.
Hurray the Hinduism survive again.
In the same way, Sivaism was incorporated into Vedic religion.
So folks, i have given you ample examples and show you the TRUTH behind the Hinduism and Kiratas as well.
It’s up to you to accept and believe what i have preach. Maybe one day when i come back to Nepal, i can help save Hinduism becoming
minority as people are blindly converting to Christians.
I don’t blame them. As long as we do not re-educate our folks about the Truth about Hinduism and Kiratas,
1. people will continue to convert to other religion
2. There will always be an ethnic division and not Unity among Mongol/Tibeto-Burmese people
dilip said
The First Kirat-Mongol King was Shambara who fought against King Divo-dasa of Aryan and not “Vasu-Deo” as i put it. Sorry for the misleading Typo error!!
Here’s more about King Shambara and the early period of Nepal.
short excerpt from the article “Vedic Aryan entry into Nepal”
“The famous war between Kirati Emperor Sambara and King Divo-dasa is described even in the Rig-Veda”….
Vedic Aryan entry into Nepal By Shiva Raj Shrestha “Malla”
Very little is known about pre-historical Nepal, its people and Aryan entry into Nepal. A hazy picture of Aryan invasion of Nepal and the contemporary aborigines people of Nepal can be drawn with the help of Sata-Patha Brahman and various Puranas. Famous scholars and historians like Pargter, Kirfel, K P Jaiswal and Dr Satya Ketu Vidyalankar have very firmly opined that on the basis of Puranas, an outline of Vedic Aryan Civilization and its clash with Harappa-Sindha Civilization can be drawn.
The great march
The Aryans of Rig-Vedic Age of some 4000-4500 years before-present (BP) were firmly established up to Kurukchetra (the region near Delhi), Panchal (present day Bareli-Muradabad) and Ayodhya. But they had not succeeded in conquering the present day Northern Bihar and Terai areas in Nepal, as these places were covered with extremely dense foothill jungles, which were sparsely populated by Indo-Austroid tribes like Nishadh and Santhals. According to “Sath Path Brahman” (supposed to have been written some 3,000 years BP in the Latter Vedic Age), a king named Mathav Videha accompanied by his priest Gautam Rahugana, Viswanarea (holy fire) and a large army, marched through this jungle (slashing, burning and making roads for their horses and chariots), succeeded to cross River Gandaki (Sada-Nira) and established his kingdom as far as Janakpur. Even now, the hermitage of Rahugana can be seen near Deaughat. No reliable data to support the period of Mathav Videha and Gautam Rahugana are available, but Radha Kumund Mukherjee (Hindu Civilization) writes that it should be after 4,500 BP, because they had marched from the banks of (now lost) River Saraswoti during Rig-Veda time.
By the time of Lord Shiva and Goddess Parvati, the present day Deaughat had already become a religious centre and many famous sages of Vedic times had already started meditating in the mountainous regions of upper Gandaki basins. According to Skandha Purana, Goddess Parvati had paid respect to famous sages like Marichi, Pulaha, Narada and Angira (the original ones or their incarnations or successors). According to Vayu Purana, King Divo-dasa was ruling North Western India, when the marriage of Lord Shiva with Parvati took place. According to Matsya Purana, King Divo-dasa belonged to the 38th generation after Baibaswata Manu. Manu himself belonged to some 66 generations before the period of Lord Rama. Ancient Indian Historical Tradition places the time of Lord Rama at around 1600 BC. On the basis of Puranic Vanasvalis (King name list), Dr S K Vydyalanker (Vedic Age) also estimates this time to be some 3,500 BP.] Therefore, Baibaswata Manu’s time can be estimated at 4,820 BP (assuming that an average of 20 years can be given to the rule of one king). Therefore, King Divo-dasa can be placed some 700 years after the Baibaswata Manu (or his time to be some 4,100 years BP). Therefore, Lord Shiva and Goddess Parvati’s time can be estimated at 4,100 years BP ,or slightly earlier from the time when King Mathav Videha had entered Nepal. Rahul Sankrityana (in Divo-dasa) has indicated that the Aryan clans of Purus and Tritsus of King Divo-dasa’s time had reached as far as the western banks of River Yamuna only. Therefore, it is logical to think that King Mathab-Videha’s time was slightly later than the time of Divo-dasa or Lord Shiva.
The Puranic record about the entry of the Aryans into Nepal and India has not yet been taken into account. It is indicated from Skanda Purana (Manas Khanda) that one of the most ancient Pre-Vedic Aryan clans of Urus had also entered Far-Western Nepal via Uru Parvat (present day Urai Pass in Bajhang district) probably before the time of Lord Shiva. According to Kurma Purana, the great clan of Urus were dissidents of Chachkus Manu, who was a dissident of Emperior Uttan Pada. Raja Bena and Prithu were also born to the Uru Dynasty. Dakshya Prajapati-II (father of Sati Devi) was also a dissident of Emperor Prithu. Even before the time of Dakshya Prajapati-II, King Sushil (the great grandson of Emperor Prithu) had gone to Himalayas for a meditation (probably from present day Afghanistan). This Puranic record is in line with Dr. Harnley’s view that some Aryans of Iela Vansa (Moon Dynasty) had entered India, after crossing Himalayan passes.
The Indo-Austroid sub-races, broadly named as Nishadhas in Puranas, controlled the Himalayan foothill jungles during the Rig-Vedic times. Santhals controlled more eastern parts of these areas. The Puranic descriptions of these people exactly fit with anthropological features of Indo-Austroid people: broad nose, black complexion, thick lips and so on. The findings of the fossilized remains of Ramapithecus mostly in the Siwalic Hills of Pakistan, India and Nepal suggest the evolution of the man in this sub-continent. The fossilized tooth of a Ramapithecus, found by a joint team of American and Nepalese anthropologists in 1980, in Tinau-Butwal area of Nepal, was found to be 11 million years old and the second oldest in the world. There might have been a very small population of “Homo Erectus” and “Homo-Sapiens” in Churea Hills and in lower valleys of the Mahabharat Range of Kumaun, Gadhwal and Nepal. This fact has been also confirmed by archeological findings of middle paleolithic weapons in Kathmandu valley and neolithic tools found in Dang, Lubhu, Nawalparasi, Kavre, Palpa, Sankhuwasava, Morang and Jhapa. Some 30 thousand years old cave-paintings, found near Dalavanda Village of Kumaun, just across Mahakali river, are also an important archaeological evidence to confirm the existence of the ancestors of modern day Kiratas (Raji or Raj-Kiratis) and various Indo-Austroid tribal of Nepal.
Famous historian Baburam Acharya has written (Purnima) that the settlements of “Aagneya” people (Nishadhas and Santhals) were like islands. They used to live in small openings by the banks of rivers in the Himalayan foothill jungles. Rahul Shankrityana (Kaneila Ki Katha) writes that the Kiratas were living in the hilly regions, north of River Ganga. They used to come to lower parts of the jungles even up to the down-stream banks of the river like Ghagra. Here, they used to have frequent battles with Nishadhas, mostly for the control of hunting grounds. By 2,500 BC or so, the Nishadhas were already using copper weapons, and therefore, could drive-away the latter-stone-age Kiratas. Most often, the Nishadhas used to take young Kirati girls as war prisoners and because of these Kirati girls, new hybrid tribes like Tharus came into existence. Later on, when Aryans invaded, it was proved that the Nishadhas were no match to them when it came to cavalry, chariots and command over superior bronze weapons.
The “Kiratas” of Western Himalayas had hundreds of fortresses and had to fight with the Vedic Aryans. The famous war between Kirati Emperor Sambara and King Divo-dasa is described even in the Rig-Veda. This is how Aryans kept on moving towards the North-east, fighting both with Kiratas as well as with Nishadhas. It seems that later on, the Kinnar-Kiratas and Naga-Kiratas had become more friendly with Aryans, as their common enemies were Nishadhas. (After the defeat of Kirata Emperor Sambara, the Nishadhas were the main enemies of the Aryans). Aryans must have realised this and by accepting Kiratas’ Supreme God Lord Shiva as their own, developed friendly ties with the Kiratas.
During Lord Shiva’s time, there seems to be a strong existence of yet another sub-race in the western and central Himalayas. They are called “Yakshyas” in various Puranas. Atkinson writes (Himalayan Gazetteer) that even up to the time of Ashoka the Great, the “Khasas” were called “Yakshyas”. Their main supporters were “Rakshyasas” and “Guihyakas”, who used to protect and exploit gold mines of Lord Kuberas (the Yakshya kings). The important centers of Yakshya Empire were the lower Manas Khanda (present day Khaptad-Malika Region and Kumaun), Southern Tribishap (Tibet) and Mustang. Varaha Purana narrates the story of two sons of Lord Kubera, who were ruling Mustang region in the North Western Nepal. Probably, this Caucasian sub-race of “Yakshyas” had mixed blood with Mongolian sub-races of Tibet that entered Nepal earlier than the “Vedic” Aryans.
ram said
Dilip all these what you wrote is false and there is no clue.who are real kiranti?They were bramhan you don’t know that later they degrated and became chetri and they are not mongoloied people.
dilip said
Dear, Ram.
The Kirat-Mongol were warriors and hunters but because they did not conform to Vedic teachings, that means the Kiratas were addicted to meat, alcohol and did not believe in caste system and so on, the Kiratas were degraded as sudras and low-born man.
The termm Kiranti came to be through the process of Sanskritization by Brahmins in Nepal.
Kirat >> Kirant
Kirat >> Kiranti
Due to the Sanskritization by Brahmins rulers in Nepal after the conquest of Shah, all the Tibeto-Burnmese(Kirat people) had almost lost their language, religion and culture.
On my next post, i will show you what the term “Kirat” originated from and who are these people again. Maybe in the mean time you can do some research too.
chandra said
I don’t belive kiranti means chetri see manusmriti.Not mongoloied people.bramhan white and chetri look like yellow.
ram said
You all are fool.
lila said
Rame is wrong and dilip is right.
lila said
Rame why you speak stupid what’s wrong with dilip he is producing such huge evidence then what about you.
Ram said
How did he know all these things then is he bramhan?
Ram said
Is there any bramhan in this page.
Rajneesh said
Stop this RamLila and let Dilip write his articles.
JTM said
Today anyone can read the scriptures, vedas, upanishads, etc if they feel upto it.
JTM said
Lord Shiva is/was a mountain dweller. It is there in every visual rendering of him. So it is likely that mt races knew of him before and he was introduced and blended in the vedic relgion. Lord ganesh also grew up living with his parents in Mt Kailash. Vishnu came from the oceans so coastal people can stake claim on him. Brahma sits on a lotus so wherever lotus grows can stake claim on him. Finally it sems that Hindusim has been the meeting point of various people with their ancient beliefs.
Dilip said
I be gone for long because i got things to attend something.
Here’s something for you people to read.
Just cut and paste this link into the browser.
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2199990/HISTORY-OF-THE-KIRAT-PEOPLE
This links is the work of History of the Kirat People, published in 2003. This work tells all i have written and more.
This work tells the origin of every Indo-Mongoliad people in Nepal, Assam and Sikkim such as Rai, Limbu, Gurung, Magar, Tamangs, and so on.
Happy readings. When i come back post any question to me.
See you.
Dilip
JTM said
Dear Dilip
Thanks for the limk. Everybody should read it.
Shan dynasty becoming Shah dynasty all fits in very well.
JTM said
They might as well return to their roots and wipe out all the futile and fruitless layers of Chittorey stuff if they want to be reaccepted back with some dignity and place in Nepalese heritage.
Amfoi said
#109
I m a Brahmin.
A pork eating Brahmin..!
Nisha said
116# Whats new in it? Nowadays lots of Brahmins eat pork..janai sanai kholera bosoi boso bhako sungur ko maasu ramaai ramaai khancha…
theba said
Nisha Bahini…
Janai Kholcha ra… Mostly aajkal ta “Royal Stag” ra “Signature” ko Bottle Kholcha hoina ra…Pork Ko Masu Sanga… Ramai Ramai
He He..
Chandra said
Yeah…Kathmandu ko ring road ma bhayeko bahuni restaurants ma pork matra hoina beef pani pauchha !
Sanity said
#118.
Hana janai pani lauchha ra aajkal ko jamana ma? I am very sure the new-gens don’t wear them.
Dilip said
How is everybody? Dud you guys read the History of the Kirat People?
Any Questions on it?
Anyway here’s more information.
This is regarding the first question “In one of my previous posts, I had argued that phallic worship could have been originated from Sino-Tibetan/Austro-Asiatic people present in India’s north-east and east. My argument stems from the fact that neither Dravidian tribes nor vedic aryan practice phallic worship and it’s observed among Sino-Tibetan people of Nepal and north-east India. Now I suppose its presence among Austro-Asiatics could be because of contact with Sino-Tibetans.”
The age of worshiping of phallic stones is that it could belong to Neolithic or maybe Megalithic period! Kiratas history is certainly that long.
This video shows the Kirat Temple in Nepal. Look closely and you find three stones in a phallus shape The three stones are the main deities of the Kirat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zad3XncfGhY
For the information: As the Kirat people in the beginning were rationalistic idolaters, they neither had temples, altars nor images, conceiving that none of these was necessary, but that the God resided in light and fire.
We could say that the image of Siva was constructed by vedic Aryan and it could have no relevant to Kirat religions. However the worshiping of phallic stone representing Siva by vedic aryans definitely “smells a rat” that Kirat religion felled into the hands of vedic aryans.
Hence interestingly one need to ponder, Did Kirat really started the Shaivism religion and the cult and trantics associated with Shaivism because scholars have now seen the link that worshiping of stones and nature originated from Kirats and not Vedic Aryan.
Hinduism in the first place has no single founder.
This explains more about the early vedic religion. It throws the light that Vedic aryans have been cheating the people about the
Hinduism.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xjv9gfcfrU&feature=channel_page
Dinesh Prasad Saklani in his work Ancient communities of the Himalaya said that the worshiped of phallus stones might have started with Kiratas although the Kiratas never call themselves as Shaivas.
John Marshall, John Hubert Marshall Sir in Mohenjo-Daro and the Indus Civilization said that the vedic aryans placed Siva into the Hindu trinity
to bring the aboriginal people into the vedic aryan society.
Likewise Shiva Raj Shrestha “Malla” in his article agreed that Vedic Aryan incorporated Kiratas religion into theirs to bring the Kiratas into their society.
Here’s the excerpt from “Vedic Aryan entry into Nepal”.
“The “Kiratas” of Western Himalayas had hundreds of fortresses and had to fight with the Vedic Aryans. The famous war between Kirati Emperor Sambara and King Divo-dasa is described even in the Rig-Veda. After the defeat of Kiratas, the Nishadhas were the main enemies of the Aryans. Aryans must have realized this and by accepting Kiratas Supreme God Lord Shiva as their own, developed friendly ties with the Kiratas.”
So folks it can be assume that some aspects of religions in the Hinduism definitely might have started from the Kiratas.
Therefore we should never give credits to vedic aryans that they were the only people in ancient India to have founded this Hinduism religion.
The Kiratas had been living in ancient India since immemorial time and Vedic Aryans and Kiratas had always fought for land and survival.
In the same way the Hinduism became unpopular because of the vedic-aryans teachings and ideology.
Teachings of Manusmriti and “chatur-varna” are some of vedic-aryans teachings and ideology, in a sense that these two teachings was a origin religion of vedic-aryan.
Kirata’s religions do not have Manusmriti and “chatur-varna” issue hence everyone is treated equally.
Dilip said
Brahmins and Chettris of Vedic Aryan are prohibited from eating meat especially of beef, buffalo and pork. They are also not allowed to drink alcohol. The reason is because of the vedic religion. If these people do consume any of these prohibited foods and drinks as mentioned above, they will lose their caste.
Brahmins and Chhetris in Nepal are the tagadhari jats,
which means that they are twice born because they are
wearing the janai, the sacred thread. In the Sanskrit texts
the Vaishya jat is also considered as a twice-born jat, “the
three first castes are all called Dvijas (twice born) because
after the first birth from mother they are born again with
the sacred girdle girting round their body” (Garuda Purana
I, I.94.24).
“The sacred thread investiture of Brahman shall
be performed in the eight year from conception or nativity,
that of a Ksatriya in the eleventh year and that of a Vaishya
in the twelfth year or according to some, as is the
convention in the family” (Garuda Purana I, I.94.1,
Gobhila-Grihya-Sutra, II Prapathaka, 10 Kandika, 1-4).
“Until the sixteenth year the time has not passed for a
Brahmana, until the twenty-second for a Kshatriya, until
the twenty-fourth for a Vaishya. After that time (has
passed), they become patitasavitrika (i.e. they have lost
their right of being taught the Savitri (the holy verses of the
Vedas)). Let them not initiate such men, nor teach them,
nor perform sacrifices for them, nor form matrimonial
alliances with them” (Gobhila-Grihya-Sutra, II Prapathaka,
10 Kandika,5-6)
But nowadays we know these people do not conform with their religious rite. This is one example of how Brahmins and Chettris of Vedic Aryan changes over time.
They are opportunistic and greedy. Nepal would only progress when people from janajatis start taking political roles and becoming PM/President of Nepal. Just take a look of Sikkim. 15 years ago and now when PM of Sikkim is Pawan Chamling Rai for these past 10 years. Just look at the changes the Sikkim has went through. Corruption is at the lowest and discrimination barely exist in Sikkim while development of Sikkim is uphill.
But Kiratas on the other hand indulge in meat and alcohol.
The Kirat religion do not have any of these taboos. The alcohol drink is very important aspects in Kirat religions. Alcohol and animal sacrifice are daily norms in Kirat religions and life.
That’s why the Kiratas are labeled mleecha(non-vedic barbarians)in veda and other vedic scriptures.
The Vedic religion do not engage in all this kind of blood rituals and sacrifices of animals.
But yet today, the brahmins and chettris happily claimed that all aspects of this religion belongs to vedic.
In the Kamakhya Temple By Kali Prasad Goswami
“Swami Prajnananda says Savarotsava is Durga Puja. Swami Abhedananda remarks that Durga was worshiped by Savar, Barbar, Pulinda caste. She was addicted to meat and wine, etc. The Chandipuza of autumn season was therefore called Savarotsava………….Durga and Chandi were the goddess of the Kirata caste. So Durga other name is Kiratini”. ~
This is again another example where Kirat religion has been incorporated into Vedic Religion.
JTM said
But many go thru the thread ceremonies and dont learn the vedas. What are they called?
Dilip said
Check these videos in the youtube:
“Sakela~The Greatest Festival of Kirat People” and you find more about Kirat’s history, religion and culture who are believed to have started the religion of worshiping phallus stones.
also check the video “Kirat Temple”
This video you will see three phallus stones which is the main deities of these people.
But you won’t see any idol of Shiva unlike other Hindu Shiva temple.
Check the video “holy in Mongolia” and one sees the stone worshiping in Mongolia.
The relevant video of stone worshiping in Mongolia, existence of Sivaism in China and as far as Japan and comparing with that of stone worshiping by Kiratas in Nepal shows that the worshiping of stone originated from Mongol people and not Vedic Arayan.
Kiratas find refences in Veda, Puranas and epics of ancient aryan text.
Naya_Nepal said
Sudarshan Raj Tiwari in his book “The Brick and the Bull”, 2002 (Pg. 23) states, “The similarities among the cultural practices of bygone days leave little doubt that the Kirants did indeed come from the Indus-Saraswati Valley.” It has not been definitely ascertained where the Kirants came from.
Some article from “PRE-HISTORIC NEPAL”
Kira (edge) ta (roam)- so Kiratas thought to refer to aboriginal people roaming at the edge of Aryan settlements. Vamsavalis indicate Kiratas as the successors of the Gopalas and the Mahispalas. Some vamsavalis mention the Kiratas took the Bagmati route from the south to enter the valley (Tiwari, 2001). Slusser suggests earlier drifters from the Tibetan plateau to be the ancestors of Kiratas who in turn were the ancestors of the Newars (Slusser, 1982).
Whereas the Gopalas and Mahispalas were thought to have come from India and followed Vedic Hinduism with Vaisnavite inclination, the Kiratas were thought to be the followers of Shiva. Kirateswore Sivalinga and proto-Lichchvi Kali of Aryaghat are indicative of Sivaite following among Kiratas.
According to N. M. Thulung, Kirata folklore suggests the Kiratas originated from “Mong” in China. They split into the Chyan, Tyan and Hyan genets.
—-> The Chyan moved south to the Indus Valley
—-> and from there into Nepal after the Aryan invasion.
The Aryans entered the Indus Valley in waves between 2000-1200 BC and expanded into the Gangetic plains. The Aryans referred to the original inhabitants as “Dasa”, “Dasyu” and later “Saka” and they were excluded from the Aryan society because they had different religious beliefs.
—–>The Manusmriti identifies the Kiratas as one of the eleven tribes who inhabited the Indus-Saraswoti region.
Tiwari believes some of these tribes were forced to move away from their homeland and into the Kumaon region. While the Khas set up their kingdom in the Kumaon hills, the Kiratas moved on to settle in the Kathmandu Valley (Tiwari, 2002). While no remains of temples were found in the Indus Valley, archaeologists have concluded that worship of the primal form of Siva, Rudra, was popular.
The Kiratas worshipped Ajima (Yumi) or grandmother and Ajju or Bhairav or Hathvan (Theba) or grandfather and these traditions are existent in eastern Nepal. Some writers consider the imageless piths of Kanga Ajima, Luti Ajima and Maiti Ajima as remains of Kirata goddesses. Yumi was worshipped as mother goddess; Rais and Limbus also worship Yumis. Popular Newari belief links Indrachowk Akash Bhairav and Pachali Bhairav to Kirata king Yalambar Hang and his son Pabbi respectively. Places worshipped as Bhairav were memorials of kings: Akash Bhairav of Indrachowk commemorates King Yalambar while Pachali Bhairav is for the Kirata king of Pharping. One interesting point is the Hadigaon inscription of Amshuvarman listing state recognized religious sites. None of the above sites were cited or were lumped under “tadnyadevakulam” indicating they did not find favor with the then rulers (Tiwari, 2001).
Many early Kirata settlements probably emerged around mother goddesses and Bhairav temples. There probably were also Kirat defenses on hilltops such as Phulchoki, Nagarjun, Champa Devi, Nagarkot gap, Nuwakot etc. The vamsavalis tell of Kirata palaces at Phulchoki, Godavari, Gokarna and later Pulchowk but there are no remains to corroborate the statements. The Mandeva palace at Gokarna is thought to be the Kirata palace but since it is a cave, its likelihood being the remains of a Kirata palace is remote. The Kirata towns on hilltops were referred to as pringgas eg. Pharping, Khopring (Bhaktapur) and dula suffix meant settlements on slopes: Kupondol (Newari term dol for dula).
link: http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:Rgfmj66QfpwJ:www.nec.edu.np/faculty/vijayb/Gopalas%2520%26%2520Kiratas.doc+%E2%80%9CThe+Brick+and+the+Bull%E2%80%9D&cd=16&hl=en&ct
Naya_Nepal said
Ravana was a great King of Sinhalese(Lanka). He fought the vedic aryan who wanted to impose vedic religion on Sinhalese.
It was also a war for territorial. Since the Dravidian Sinhalese & Kiratas(indo-mongoloid) did not conform with vedic culture
and fought against vedic kings, both Dravdian and Kiratas were label Rakshas(demon).
Mahabharata & Ramayan – are basically the tales of conquests and propaganda by the invading Aryan race. All the asuras – evil – are basically indigenous peoples of Australoid, Dravidian, Kiratas races. All the good guys – good – are the Aryan folks. Next time you celebrate Dashain as ‘victory of good over evil’, you know you are merely celebrating the subjugation of indigenous/tribal/aboriginal peoples by the invading Aryan race.
The Kiranteshwor – or Kailash or Shiva – is an indigenous icon, probably the only best symbol of Indigenous resistance to the Aryan invasion . After he married a Brahmin girl Goma / Sati, he’s been co-opted as a Hindu God.
Well Brahimns also they have even co-opted Lord Buddha as one of their own. They have called him an incarnation of Bishnu, just like they said the Shah king of Nepal is an incarnation of Bishnu.
About Nepal King, well it all goes back to the Sankaracharya of south India. Nepali kings needed them to rewrite their origin myths – as incarnations of gods so they could rule the diverse lot with iron fists. So ever since the Hindu Kings and brahmins have been cahoots – the most enduring partnership but certainly in recent times this partnership is coming undone as scholars and others who have done an extensive studies are hightlignh the truth.
The Aryans are wiliest, craftiest, & foxiest race. You can see this in the leadership of the Maoists as well as that of the seven political parties. You can see this in India – Brahmins comprise may be 5-10% of India’s population but they are the ruling elites. Largest democracy – but what a sham! The only way for the marginalised to counter this is to smarten up and to chip away at the foundation of Brahminism, feudalism, casteism, Patriarchy, Sanskrit education, and most importantly through fighting for a right to self determination in the emerging Nepali federal republic set up.